[Bldg-sim] NECB 2011 - Interpretation of 4.3.2.10

Cheney chenyu73 at gmail.com
Thu Jul 10 10:58:53 PDT 2014
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Thank you, Frederic, for the clarification.

Now the new question is, which category time-scheduling devices belong to?
Am I right to say it is kind of automatic? Apparently ASHRAE treats
time-scheduling and occupant-sensing devices differently (Table G 3.2 in
Appendix G). If they are under the same category in NECB, time-scheduling
devices probably are overcredited? But certainly I don't think
time-scheduling will be the same as manual on/off switch.

Regards,

Cheney

LinkedIN @
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/yu-cheney-chen-ph-d-bemp-leed-ap-bd-c/27/637/72b


On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 10:16 AM, Genest, Frederic <fgenest at pageaumorel.com>
wrote:

>  Hello Cheney.
>
>
>
> Never been confronted with the case, so I’m eduguessing my way though the
> Trade-off Path.
>
>
>
> Since the reference case never has any “personal control”, I gather that
> it implies “task lighting” while “occupancy-sensing mechanism – manual”
> implies “general space control”.
>
>
>
> Since personal control has a low factor (0.1), I don’t see a big problem
> with taking credit for both cases.
>
>
>
> So, somewhat correcting my initial interpretation:
>
> -       Personnal control = manual on/off control assigned to a single
> individual and normally related to task lighting or similar application
>
> -       Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism = general space control
>
> o   Manual = on/off switch
>
> o   Automatic = motion detector or the like, switching on/off
> automatically
>
>
>
> My two cents!
>
>
>
> [image: http://www.pageaumorel.com/signature/pma_sign.gif]
>
> *Frédéric Genest,*
>
> *Pageau Morel et associés inc.*
>
> ing., M.Sc.A., PA LEED BD+C / *Eng., M.A.Sc <http://M.A.Sc>., LEED AP *
> *BD+C*
> *ASHRAE HBDP*
> *Chargé de projet / Project Manager*
> *Associé / Associate*
> *fgenest at pageaumorel.com <fgenest at pageaumorel.com>*
>
> 210, boul. Crémazie O., bur. 110
> Montréal (Québec) H2P 1C6
> T 514.382.5150 (2203)
> F 514.384.9872
> *www.pageaumorel.com* <http://www.pageaumorel.com>
>
> Poser un geste écolo : un engagement infini! Est-ce vraiment nécessaire
> d'imprimer ce courriel?
> *A green act: a commitment for infinity! Save trees. Print only when
> necessary.*
>
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>
> *De :* Cheney [mailto:chenyu73 at gmail.com]
> *Envoyé :* 9 juillet 2014 18:22
> *À :* Genest, Frederic
> *Cc :* Krauel, Danielle; bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org;
> IBPSA-GTA-L at listserv.utoronto.ca
>
> *Objet :* Re: [Bldg-sim] NECB 2011 - Interpretation of 4.3.2.10
>
>
>
> Hello Frederic,
>
>
>
> How are you?
>
>
>
> So there is no difference between Personal control and Occupancy-Sensing
> Mechanism – Manual? Taking Patient room in table 4.3.2.10.A as an example,
> it has both Relative Absence of Occupants factor 0.1 and Personal control
> factor 0.1. When a full manual on/off control is installed in such room,
> both Occupancy control and personal control factors can be claimed? If not,
> which one should be claimed in this case, since it generates different
> control factors eventually?
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Cheney
>
>
>
> LinkedIN @
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/yu-cheney-chen-ph-d-bemp-leed-ap-bd-c/27/637/72b
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 2:21 PM, Genest, Frederic <fgenest at pageaumorel.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Danielle.
>
>
> Based on a proposed code change that’s proposed for inclusion in NECB
> 2015, which clarify the description, this is what I understand it is :
>
> -       “Personal control” => Full manual on/off control
>
> -       “Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Manual” => Full manual on/off
> control (i.e. same as above)
>
> -       “Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Automatic” => full auto on/off
> control
>
>
>
> Other type of controls (bi-level, auto off/manual on) are not accounted
> for in NECB 2011 Section 4.3.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> [image: http://www.pageaumorel.com/signature/pma_sign.gif]
>
> *Frédéric Genest,*
>
> *Pageau Morel et associés inc.*
>
> ing., M.Sc.A., PA LEED BD+C / *Eng., M.A.Sc <http://M.A.Sc>., LEED AP *
> *BD+C*
>
>
>
> * ASHRAE HBDP Chargé de projet / Project Manager Associé / Associate
> fgenest at pageaumorel.com <fgenest at pageaumorel.com>*
>
> 210, boul. Crémazie O., bur. 110
> Montréal (Québec) H2P 1C6
> T 514.382.5150 (2203)
> F 514.384.9872
> *www.pageaumorel.com* <http://www.pageaumorel.com>
>
> Poser un geste écolo : un engagement infini! Est-ce vraiment nécessaire
> d'imprimer ce courriel?
> *A green act: a commitment for infinity! Save trees. Print only when
> necessary.*
>
> *AVERTISSEMENT CONCERNANT LA CONFIDENTIALITÉ / CONFIDENTIALITY MESSAGE*
> Ce courriel et toute information qui y est jointe sont confidentiels. Si
> vous avez reçu cette communication par erreur, veuillez nous en aviser
> immédiatement et effacer l'original, sans en tirer de copie ni en dévoiler
> le contenu. / *This e-mail and any information enclosed are confidential.
> **If you have received this message by error, please notify us
> immediately and delete the original without making a copy and without
> disclosing its content.*
>
>
>
>
>
> *De :* Evenson, Devin [mailto:DEvenson at hydro.mb.ca]
> *Envoyé :* 9 juillet 2014 12:57
> *À :* 'Krauel, Danielle'; bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org;
> IBPSA-GTA-L at listserv.utoronto.ca
> *Objet :* Re: [Bldg-sim] NECB 2011 - Interpretation of 4.3.2.10
>
>
>
> Hi Danielle –
>
>
>
> I don’t have a quick answer to your question but just to let you and other
> interested individuals know the Users’ Guide  for the NECB 2011 is now
> available (released a couple weeks back) for purchase at the following link
> https://commerce-irc.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/nrcb2c/b2c/display/(xcm=NRC-R3PITREX&layout=6_1_65_54_5_2&uiarea=2&ctype=areaDetails&carea=0000000064)/.do
>
>
>
>
>
> *Devin Evenson, P.Eng. CEM, CMVP*
>
> Manitoba Hydro | Customer Engineering Services
>
> General Mail: PO Box 815 STN Mail | Winnipeg, MB | R3C 2P4
>
> Courier: 6-360 Portage Ave | Winnipeg, MB | R3C 0G8
>
> tel. 204-360-3971 | fax 204-360-6109
>
> devenson at hydro.mb.ca
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Bldg-sim [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org
> <bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] *On Behalf Of *Krauel, Danielle
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 09, 2014 11:02 AM
> *To:* bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org; IBPSA-GTA-L at listserv.utoronto.ca
> *Subject:* [Bldg-sim] NECB 2011 - Interpretation of 4.3.2.10
>
>
>
> Hello,
>
>
>
> Quick question about the NECB 2011 (Section 4.3.2.10). There are different
> factors (credits to account for):
>
> -          “Personal control”
>
> -          “Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Manual”
>
> -          “Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Automatic”
>
>
>
> What is meant by each of these? I’m assuming:
>
> -          Personal Control – An on/off switch or task light.
>
> -          Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Manual: A push-button for an
> occupancy override with timer (no switch).
>
> -          Occupancy-Sensing Mechanism – Automatic: An automatic
> occupancy sensor.
>
>
>
> If anyone can confirm my interpretation is correct, that would be great.
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> *Danielle Krauel*, ing., P.Eng., LEED AP
>
> *Halsall Associates *Tel: 613.907.7540 • Toll Free: 1.877.442.5725 ext 286
> • www.halsall.com
> Vancouver • Calgary • Sudbury • Burlington • Toronto • Ottawa
>
> *Best Workplaces in Canada,* *Eight Consecutive Years: 2007-2014     *
>
> _________________________
> *A Parsons Brinckerhoff Company*
>
>
>
>
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