No subject


Thu May 8 09:17:00 PDT 2014


using Con-Ed steam and electric rates you mentioned, for a typical =
office building you will see a benefit in using steam-turbine chillers =
(either option 2 and 3, depending on your electrical load factor and =
refrigeration full load hours). Of course, assuming that in all the =
cases you use reasonably efficient refrigeration machines.

=20

Here is how you do it in Doe2.1:

=20

INPUT PLANT..

=20

ELEC-DRIVE=3DPLANT-EQUIPMENT

 TYPE=3DHERM-CENT-CHLR

 SIZE=3D24

 INSTALLED-NUMBER=3D1

 MAX-NUMBER-AVAIL=3D1 ..

=20

=20

STEAM-CHILLER =3D PLANT-EQUIPMENT

TYPE =3D ABSOR2-CHLR

SIZE =3D 24

MAX-NUMBER-AVAIL=3D1 ..

..

=20

EQUIPMENT-QUAD

ABSOR2-CAP-FT=3DCCAPT3

ABSOR2-HIR-FT=3DEIRT3

ABSOR2-HIR-FPLR=3DEIRPLR3

..

=20

.

.

.

=20

Then in PLANT PARAMETRS you specify=20

=20

ABSOR2-HIR =3D ?

Hope this helps.

Please let me know if you have further questions

Konstantin Babets
Jaros Baum and Bolles
(212) 530 9455
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Varkie Thomas=20
  To: BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM=20
  Sent: Friday, October 01, 2004 10:40 AM
  Subject: [BLDG-SIM] Steam-Turbine Drive Centrigugal LiquidChillers


  Steve:



  I received other responses suggesting the same thing:



  1. Use 2 stage absorption chiller with HIR of the turbine

  2. Assign PLR curves of centrifugal chiller to corresponding curves of =
absorption machine.



  I assume this will produce reasonably accurate steam consumption of =
the steam-turbine.  I need a sample DOE2 Plant "inp" or "bdl" statements =
showing how to do this.  The chillers in question are York model YST.  =
York will provide the performance data.  The location is NYC and the =
utility rates are ConEd Steam Service Classification 2 (lower rates in =
summer) and ConEd Electric Service Classification 9 Rate II - General =
Large Time of Use=20



  =
http://q050-www5.coned.com/es/tariffs/ps.asp?URL=3Dtariffs.htm&s=3Dtariff=
s



  Since there are several buildings in NYC that use a hybrid plant of =
steam-turbine and electric-motor drive chillers, I assume studies have =
already been done justifying this combination.  So far I have found the =
ASHRAE Sept 2003 article: Advances in Steam Cooling by Ian Spanswick



  I would like to compare the following alternative options: (1) two =
2000-ton electric-drive chillers, (2) two 2000-ton steam-drive chillers =
and (3) one 2000-ton electric-drive chiller and one 2000-ton steam-drive =
chiller sequenced to "start first" based on ConEd year-round steam and =
electric rates.  This would be for (A) a building that operates 24 hours =
per day such as a hospital, and (B) an office building that operates 7 =
AM - 6 PM, Mon-Fri.  I would also like to see a life cycle cost analysis =
of the alternative options.  Have such studies been done for buildings =
located in cities with district steam (NYC, Boston, Philadelphia, =
Minneapolis)?



  The Trane TRACE700 program (which we also use in this office along =
with Carrier's HAP program) models steam-turbine chillers.  However the =
building in question has already been modeled in detail with DOE2.1E =
using electric chillers.  I prefer to use DOE2.1E directly (we also have =
eQUEST and EnergyPro in the office) for LEED certification and to show =
Code compliance.  The building description language (bdl) provides =
flexibility and it can be read like a specification for others to =
review.  Does this program have a future?  How many A-E design firms are =
using EnergyPlus on large commercial building projects?



  Varkie Thomas







  -----Original Message-----
  From: postman at gard.com [mailto:postman at gard.com] On Behalf Of =
stvgates at pacbell.net
  Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2004 5:13 PM
  To: BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM
  Subject: [BLDG-SIM] Steam-Turbine Drive Centrigugal Liquid Chillers



  You would need to model it as an absorption chiller.  The chiller's =
heat input ratio and performance curves would need to reflect the =
combination of the steam turbine and the chiller compressor.

    ----- Original Message -----=20

    From: Varkie Thomas=20

    To: BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM=20

    Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2004 12:58 PM

    Subject: [BLDG-SIM] Steam-Turbine Drive Centrigugal Liquid Chillers



    Has anyone modeled steam turbine drive centrifugal chillers with =
DOE2.1E?  Is it possible to add this equipment to DOE2, given the part =
load performance data?



    Varkie Thomas

=20
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
You received this e-mail because you are subscribed=20
to the BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM mailing list.  To unsubscribe=20
from this mailing list send a blank message to=20
BLDG-SIM-UNSUBSCRIBE at GARD.COM


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<BODY lang=3DEN-US vLink=3Dblue link=3Dblue bgColor=3Dwhite><FONT =
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<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Varkie,</SPAN><?xml:namespace prefix=20
=3D o ns =3D "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">From my experience in =
modeling=20
similar plant combinations in NYC and using Con-Ed steam and =
electric=20
rates you mentioned, for a typical office building you will see a =
benefit in=20
using steam-turbine chillers (either option 2 and 3, depending on your=20
electrical load factor and refrigeration full load hours). Of course, =
assuming=20
that in all the cases you use reasonably efficient refrigeration=20
machines.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Here is how you do it in=20
Doe2.1:</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">INPUT =
PLANT..<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">ELEC-DRIVE=3DPLANT-EQUIPMENT<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'"><SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: =
yes"> </SPAN>TYPE=3DHERM-CENT-CHLR<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'"><SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>SIZE=3D24<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'"><SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: =
yes"> </SPAN>INSTALLED-NUMBER=3D1<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'"><SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>MAX-NUMBER-AVAIL=3D1=20
..<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">STEAM-CHILLER =3D=20
PLANT-EQUIPMENT<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">TYPE =3D=20
ABSOR2-CHLR<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">SIZE =3D=20
24<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">MAX-NUMBER-AVAIL=3D1=20
..<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">..<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">EQUIPMENT-QUAD<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">ABSOR2-CAP-FT=3DCCAPT3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">ABSOR2-HIR-FT=3DEIRT3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">ABSOR2-HIR-FPLR=3DEIRPLR3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">..<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Then in PLANT =
PARAMETRS you=20
specify <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal=20
style=3D"MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-layout-grid-align: none"><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">ABSOR2-HIR=20
=3D ?</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: =
AR-SA"></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial>Hope this helps.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial>Please let me know if you have further =
questions</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial>Konstantin Babets</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial>Jaros Baum and Bolles</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'; =
mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; =
mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA"><FONT=20
face=3DArial>(212) 530 9455</FONT></SPAN></FONT><FONT =
size=3D2></DIV></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3DVarkie.Thomas at som.com =
href=3D"mailto:Varkie.Thomas at som.com">Varkie=20
  Thomas</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3DBLDG-SIM at GARD.COM=20
  href=3D"mailto:BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM">BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, October 01, 2004 =
10:40=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [BLDG-SIM] =
Steam-Turbine Drive=20
  Centrigugal LiquidChillers</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Steve:</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">I received other responses =
suggesting the=20
  same thing:</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">1. Use 2 stage =
absorption chiller=20
  with HIR of the turbine</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">2. Assign PLR curves of=20
  centrifugal chiller to corresponding curves of absorption=20
  machine.</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">I assume this will produce =
reasonably=20
  accurate steam consumption of the steam-turbine.  I need a sample =
DOE2=20
  Plant =93inp=94 or =93bdl=94 statements showing how to do this.  =
The chillers in=20
  question are </SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">York</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy"> model YST.  </SPAN></FONT><FONT =
color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">York</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy"> will provide the performance data.  The =
location is=20
  NYC and the utility rates are ConEd Steam Service Classification 2 =
(lower=20
  rates in summer) and ConEd Electric Service Classification 9 Rate II - =
General=20
  Large Time of Use </SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://q050-www5.coned.com/es/tariffs/ps.asp?URL=3Dtariffs.htm&am=
p;s=3Dtariffs">http://q050-www5.coned.com/es/tariffs/ps.asp?URL=3Dtariffs=
.htm&s=3Dtariffs</A></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Since there are several =
buildings in NYC=20
  that use a hybrid plant of steam-turbine and electric-motor drive =
chillers, I=20
  assume studies have already been done justifying this =
combination.  So=20
  far I have found the ASHRAE Sept 2003 article: Advances in Steam =
Cooling by=20
  Ian Spanswick</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">I would like to compare the =
following=20
  alternative options: (1) two 2000-ton electric-drive chillers, (2) two =

  2000-ton steam-drive chillers and (3) one 2000-ton electric-drive =
chiller and=20
  one 2000-ton steam-drive chiller sequenced to =93start first=94 based =
on ConEd=20
  year-round steam and electric rates.  This would be for (A) a =
building=20
  that operates 24 hours per day such as a hospital, and (B) an office =
building=20
  that operates 7 AM =96 6 PM, Mon-Fri.  I would also like to see a =
life=20
  cycle cost analysis of the alternative options.  Have such =
studies been=20
  done for buildings located in cities with district steam (NYC,=20
  </SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">Boston</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">, </SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">Philadelphia</SPAN></FONT><FONT =
color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">, </SPAN></FONT><FONT color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">Minneapolis</SPAN></FONT><FONT =
color=3Dnavy><SPAN=20
  style=3D"COLOR: navy">)?</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">The Trane TRACE700 program =
(which we also=20
  use in this office along with Carrier=92s HAP program) models =
steam-turbine=20
  chillers.  However the building in question has already been =
modeled in=20
  detail with DOE2.1E using electric chillers.  I prefer to use =
DOE2.1E=20
  directly (we also have eQUEST and EnergyPro in the office) for LEED=20
  certification and to show Code compliance.  The building =
description=20
  language (bdl) provides flexibility and it can be read like a =
specification=20
  for others to review.  Does this program have a future?  How =
many=20
  A-E design firms are using EnergyPlus on large commercial building=20
  projects?</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy">Varkie Thomas</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" color=3Dnavy =
size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DTahoma =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">-----Original=20
  Message-----<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B>=20
  postman at gard.com [mailto:postman at gard.com] <B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of=20
  </SPAN></B>stvgates at pacbell.net<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> </SPAN></FONT><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">Thursday, September=20
  30, 2004</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">5:13=20
  PM</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"><BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> =
BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [BLDG-SIM] =
</SPAN></FONT><FONT=20
  face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">Steam-Turbine=20
  Drive</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> Centrigugal Liquid=20
  Chillers</SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
  size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
  <DIV>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">You would need to model =
it as an=20
  absorption chiller.  The chiller's heat input ratio and =
performance=20
  curves would need to reflect the combination of the steam turbine and =
the=20
  chiller compressor.</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE=20
  style=3D"BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: =
medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt =
3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: =
medium none">
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">----- Original Message =
-----=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV style=3D"font-color: black">
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; MARGIN-LEFT: =
0.5in"><B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
    title=3DVarkie.Thomas at som.com =
href=3D"mailto:Varkie.Thomas at som.com">Varkie=20
    Thomas</A> </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">To:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"> <A=20
    title=3DBLDG-SIM at GARD.COM=20
    href=3D"mailto:BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM">BLDG-SIM at GARD.COM</A>=20
    </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Sent:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">=20
    </SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Thursday, September =
30,=20
    2004</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">12:58=20
    PM</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><B><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
    size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Subject:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
    face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">=20
    [BLDG-SIM] </SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Steam-Turbine=20
    Drive</SPAN></FONT><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
    style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Centrigugal Liquid=20
    Chillers</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
    <DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P></DIV>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    color=3Dnavy size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: =
navy">Has anyone=20
    modeled steam turbine drive centrifugal chillers with DOE2.1E?  =
Is it=20
    possible to add this equipment to DOE2, given the part load =
performance=20
    data?</SPAN></FONT></P>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P>
    <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: 0.5in"><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
    color=3Dnavy size=3D3><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: =
navy">Varkie=20
    Thomas</SPAN></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE style=3D"MARGIN-LEFT: =
0.5in"><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
10pt"> </SPAN></FONT></PRE></DIV><PRE>
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