[Equest-users] LEED Commercial Interiors

[Pasha Korber-Gonzalez]

Hi,

I don't have the experience with a CI project (always NC/EB for me), but in
CH 11 (ECB method) of 90.1 there is an informative note on page 66 in the
2007 version under section 11.1.4 Compliance.  This note states:

"The energy cost budget and the design energy cost calculations are
applicable only for determining compliance with this standard.  They are not
predictions of actual energy consumption or costs of the proposed design
after construction.  Actual experience will differ from these calculations
due to variations such as occupancy, building operation and maintenance,
weather, energy use not covered by this standard, changes in energy rates
between design of the building and occupancy, and precision of the
calculation tool."

These are my educated guesses based on how I have always understood CH 11 to
be:
1) It would be difficult and time wasting to simulate the effects of energy
use in all other tenant spaces in such a large building, in an existing
building case-to accuratly model the building energy supply systems, whereas
most of the other spaces wouldn't be impacting the basic energy consumption
of the smaller area of the individual tenant space (think BIG 'chunck of the
pie' versus little 'chunck of the pie.')
2) Where tenant space energy rates are based on the effects of thier own
little space, (not many influences from other spaces--then [again] why spend
the time modeling the other spaces (i.e. the rest of the building.)
3) Alternatively, speaking within the requirements of LEED compliance, the
amount of energy savings opportunity (by LEED's scale) goes way, way down
when you are are looking at; for example, 40,000 sf of tenant space versus
2,000,000 sf of building floor area.  Now your 30% savings over baseline
design (tenant space floor area only) turns into .6% savings compared to the
whole building baseline design.  This wouldn't be fair to any tenant trying
to demonstrate an impact for thier energy conservation efforts.

Although the reality might be they are "just a little fish in a big sea',
and it doesn't make a difference in the larger picture; however it still is
also the reality that it takes everyone to do just a little all together to
make a HUGE difference.  So why can't we magnify the scale a bit to truly
understand the significant impact being made relative to the space before
energy improvments were made.

...that's what I get from CH 11 and the logic of the compliance reference
for LEED CI.

I also want to recommend that you/your firm as the simulator(s) have a
discussion or write a disclaimer for your energy results report/LEED
calculation estimation--that you are not predicting
what the tenant's utility bills will be by performing this compliance
simulation.  Because of the many varialbles that might not be accounted for
in your model it just isn't possible to get that accurate for this modeling
exercise (which is based on the CH 11 ECB method that you are being required
to use.)

pasha

On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Grando, John <JGrando at cosentini.com> wrote:

>  Was your design case a chilled water system?  LEED CI says to use Section
> 11 (ECB Method) rather than Appendix G
>
>
>
> *John Grando LEED AP| Mechanical Engineer
> *
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>  *From:* Nikola Kravik [mailto:nkravik at rumseyengineers.com]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 30, 2010 2:31 PM
> *To:* 'Syed Mohsin Abidi'; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
>
> *Subject:* Re: [Equest-users] LEED Commercial Interiors
>
>    Do one floor only, not the entire building.
>
> Watch out for the baseline system type choice.
>
> Although is may seem strange, but your baseline should be CHW System, not
> Packaged or whatever the requirement is for one story bld.
>
> At least this is the approach I was told to use here in San Francisco, CA
> when I first modeled 6th floor (1 story LEED CI) out of 30+ high rise…….It
> wasn’t Equest as simulation tool, but that shouldn’t matter.
>
>
>
> Others, can you add your experience with LEED CI?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nikola
>
>
>
> *From:* equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:
> equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] *On Behalf Of *Syed Mohsin
> Abidi
> *Sent:* Monday, March 29, 2010 6:56 AM
> *To:* equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Equest-users] LEED Commercial Interiors
>
>
>
> Need help regarding LEED 2009 CI project.
>
> Our project scope is just a single office floor in a 35 story high rise
> building in new York city. Now for simulation using EQUEST do we need to
> perform simulation for the entire building or just that one floor that is
> related to our scope of work in order to gain credits for Energy Atmosphere.
>
>
>
> Please guide.
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> *Syed Mohsin Abidi, *EIT, LEED AP**
>
> *TSF Engineering, P.C.***
>
> Consulting MEP Engineers
>
> 200 Park Avenue South
>
> New York, New York 10003
>
> *Tel. 212.253.7303*
>
> *Fax.212.253.6512*
>
> Sabidi at tsfengineers.com
>
>
>
> P Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail
>
>
>
>
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