[Equest-users] Query regarding PDEC ( Passive cooling ) simulation in eQuest

Chalfoun, Nader V - (chalfoun) chalfoun at email.arizona.edu
Fri Mar 16 10:16:57 PDT 2012
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Dear Mansi,

I am attaching the CoolT program for sizing Passive Downdraft Evaporative Cooling devices.  As Vikram said, the program is a dos based and can be run from windows XP.  The program calculates temperature drop, water consumption and other important thermodynamic values based on many variables including Pads evaporative cooling efficiency, thickness and area, tower effective height (z), discharge mode (bottom or side) indoor (with screens or outdoor).

The only issue is that it has 8 built-in climate zones.  If your climate zone is not included, I have to added and re-compile the program.  If your climate zone has somehow close moisture and temperature data than the once included, you can approximate the results.

Good luck with that and let me know if I could be of additional assistance to you.

Cheers,

Nader

Check my new online energy courses http://www.hed-online.com<http://www.hed-online.com/>
--------------------------------------------
Nader V. Chalfoun, Ph.D., LEED© AP, CEA
Professor of Architecture and Environmental Sciences
Director: The House Energy Doctor Program http://houseenergydoctor.arizona.edu<http://houseenergydoctor.arizona.edu/>
Chair: Master of Science in Architecture Program
Coordinator: Environmental Education Ph.D. Minor
Faculty: Global Change Ph.D. Minor
Address:  University of Arizona
               College of Architecture and Landscape Architecture
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               Phone: (520)621-6751    Fax: (520)621-8700

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From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Joe Huang [yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2012 12:05 PM
To: Mansi Jayswal
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org; Design Builder USA
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Query regarding PDEC ( Passive cooling ) simulation in eQuest

Mansi,

If CoolT is as Vikram describes, this might be the solution to your problem.  The main issue for you is to know the air flow output of the PDEC  in actual operations, not under design conditions, so that other program you mentioned for sizing the PDEC is of little help.  If CoolT is not able to give you air flow rates based on the ambient conditions and the indoor air temperature, you could try building a simple two-zone model (PDEC, Building) using CONTAM and then run that stand-alone to get the air flows between the two zones.

In reference to Vikram's comment, I've said all along that the difference between the PDEC and a  standard DEC
is the mechanism used to drive the air across the media - using natural bouyancy forces in the first case and a mechanical fan in the second case.  Once you have the air flow rate, the PDEC is actually simpler to model because there's no need to model fan efficiency and heat gain, etc.  In fact, it just takes a single effectiveness curve, or even just a constant effectiveness number.

Joe

Joe Huang
White Box Technologies, Inc.
346 Rheem Blvd., Suite 108D
Moraga CA 94556
yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com<mailto:yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com>
www.whiteboxtechnologies.com<http://www.whiteboxtechnologies.com>
(o) (925)388-0265
(c) (510)928-2683
"building energy simulations at your fingertips"


On 3/8/2012 6:49 AM, Mansi Jayswal wrote:

Thanks Vikram,

Could you tell me from where i can download this Software  " CoolT" ? i have tried to Google but did not find it anyware. I have even found one of your research paper. it seems you have already worked on it. it will be great if you could guide me.



On Thu, Mar 8, 2012 at 7:37 PM, Sami, Vikram <Vikram.Sami at perkinswill.com<mailto:Vikram.Sami at perkinswill.com>> wrote:

Another option to look into is CoolT developed by Nader Chalfoun at University of Arizona in Tucson. It’s a Dos program that is based on empirical data that they collected from the extensive testing they did on Cool Towers (Passive Downdraught Chimneys).



Again – I would throw in words of caution. Passive downdraught chimneys rely on buoyancy driven forces – something that you cannot approximate with a fan driven evaporative cooler or wind driven. eQUEST might be able to model this, but its beyond my knowledge. Also – The folks at UA (Nader Chalfoun & Martin Yoklic) did some testing with cool towers in enclosed spaces. I would try writing to them to get some feedback on issues to consider.



I think Nader is on this list – not sure if he’s still active.





Vikram Sami, LEED AP BD+C

Sustainable Design Analyst

1315 Peachtree St. NE, Atlanta, GA 30309

t: 404-443-7462    f: 404.892.5823       e: vikram.sami at perkinswill.com<mailto:vikram.sami at perkinswill.com>   www.perkinswill.com<http://www.perkinswill.com/>

Perkins+Will.  Ideas + buildings that honor the broader goals of society





From: Mansi Jayswal [mailto:ar.mansi.jayswal at gmail.com<mailto:ar.mansi.jayswal at gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2012 2:40 AM
To: Design Builder USA
Cc: Dahlstrom, Aaron; Sami, Vikram; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>

Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Query regarding PDEC ( Passive cooling ) simulation in eQuest

Thank you all for your quick response and Information.

Is it possible that if i use PHDC software to design the PDEC system and simulate the same building in eQuest ??  PHDC software can give me the required size of the passive down draught evaporating cooling towers for the building.

On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 9:37 PM, Design Builder USA <jcrossett at designbuilderusa.com<mailto:jcrossett at designbuilderusa.com>> wrote:

You may wish to explore the free trial of Design Builder, as it has CFD, natural ventilation and evaporate cooling.

Tho I am not sure if it can be used for your passive cooling requirement or not..

Best of luck

On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 6:53 AM, Dahlstrom, Aaron <ADahlstrom at in-posse.com<mailto:ADahlstrom at in-posse.com>> wrote:

Mansi –

We have done some schematic modeling of wind towers with Fluent, a CFD package as noted.

Our climate didn’t justify evaporative pre-cooling.

eQUEST has a natural ventilation module, which I have not fully dived into.

I believe it requires inputs that would likely be validated by a CFD model – for example, I don’t think eQUEST’s natural ventilation model allows for evaporative pre-cooling as a temperature driver for natural air exchange in a space.

As eQUEST models each zone as a fully mixed space, and has limited air transfer between zones, you may also have trouble getting the thermal stratification from eQUEST that would typically be needed to drive natural ventilation in a PDEC.

Aaron Dahlstrom , PE, LEED® AP

In Posse – A subsidiary of AKF| 1500 Walnut Street, Suite 1414, Philadelphia, PA 19102

d: 215-282-6753<tel:215-282-6753>| m: 267-507-5470<tel:267-507-5470>| In Posse: 215-282-6800<tel:215-282-6800>| AKF: 215-735-7290<tel:215-735-7290>

e: ADahlstrom at in-posse.com<mailto:ADahlstrom at in-posse.com> | in posse web: www.in-posse.com<http://www.in-posse.com/> | akf web: www.akfgroup.com<http://www.akfgroup.com/>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] On Behalf Of Sami, Vikram
Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2012 8:53 AM
To: Mansi Jayswal; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Query regarding PDEC ( Passive cooling ) simulation in eQuest

Mansi,

I doubt you can do this credibly in eQUEST. You really need a CFD type package to be able to simulate this. . A word of caution – the effort to develop the simulation for this is a master’s thesis in itself.

Vikram Sami, LEED AP BD+C

Sustainable Design Analyst

1315 Peachtree St. NE, Atlanta, GA 30309

t: 404-443-7462<tel:404-443-7462>    f: 404.892.5823<tel:404.892.5823>       e: vikram.sami at perkinswill.com<mailto:vikram.sami at perkinswill.com>   www.perkinswill.com<http://www.perkinswill.com/>

Perkins+Will.  Ideas + buildings that honor the broader goals of society

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org]<mailto:[mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org]> On Behalf Of Mansi Jayswal
Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2012 11:25 PM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: [Equest-users] Query regarding PDEC ( Passive cooling ) simulation in eQuest

Hello friends,

My name is Mansi Jayswal. I am a final year student of Masters Programme at CEPT University, India. By profession I am an architect. Currently I am doing thesis on passive cooling technique (Passive down draught evaporative cooling system- PDEC ). And try to identified that how much cooling load of HVAC system can be replaced through this system.

Now my query is that is it eQuest is capable to simulate such building with wind tower or PHDC (PDEC ) system? If anybody knows please kindly reply. I have very days left for final submission and I am stuck here.

Thanks

--

Regards,

Mansi Jayswal,

B.Arch I IGBC AP I M.Tech in Climate Change & Sustainable Development

Faculty of Sustainable Environment & Climate Change,

Centre for Environmental Planning & Technology (CEPT) University

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--

Jeremiah D. Crossett

Energy Modeling Consultant

503-688-8951

www.DesignBuilderUSA.com<http://www.DesignBuilder.com>









--

Regards,

Mansi Jayswal,

B.Arch I IGBC AP I M.Tech in Climate Change & Sustainable Development

Faculty of Sustainable Environment & Climate Change,

Centre for Environmental Planning & Technology (CEPT) University



--

Regards,
Mansi Jayswal,
B.Arch I IGBC AP I M.Tech in Climate Change & Sustainable Development
Faculty of Sustainable Environment & Climate Change,
Centre for Environmental Planning & Technology (CEPT) University



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