[Equest-users] LEED and Seasonal operation / DHW heater seasonal operation

[Bishop, Bill]

Nick,
eQUEST calculates a default TANK-VOLUME and TANK-UA if none is entered to account for DHW heat losses. If you enter "0" for the TANK-UA your July and August DHW energy will go to zero. As David said, however, this may not be reasonable unless the gas is turned off to the unit during the summer or controls lock it out.
Regards,
Bill

William Bishop, PE, BEMP, BEAP, LEED AP | Pathfinder Engineers & Architects LLP
Senior Energy Engineer

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134 South Fitzhugh Street                 Rochester, NY 14608

T: (585) 698-1956                        F: (585) 325-6005

bbishop at pathfinder-ea.com<mailto:wbishop at pathfinder-ea.com>             www.pathfinder-ea.com<http://www.pathfinder-ea.com/>

[earth for signature]Sustainability - the forest AND the trees.



From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Nick Patsos
Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2014 10:53 AM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED and Seasonal operation / DHW heater seasonal operation

Thank you all very much for the answers, they were very helpful.

I m attaching the project files for anyone to have a look. The problem is that during July and August the DHW boiler should be completely off since dhw loop and pump show zero at simulation output.

eQuest version used is 3.64.

Weather file also included in the rar as well as simulation output.

Nikos Patsos
Mechanical Enginner

On 30 January 2014 03:58, David Eldridge <DEldridge at grummanbutkus.com<mailto:DEldridge at grummanbutkus.com>> wrote:
Will the DHW really be shut off? I can see the AHUs might be turned off during the summer...if you can show a control sequence of operation that turns off the AHUs it would help the documentation. However if the DHW is switched off manually for the season there might be some pushback that modeling losses would be appropriate in case it doesn't actually get deactivated, or if there might be the occasional event at the school during the summer time?

You might want to simulate the year-round HVAC operation case so you have a fall back savings percentage number in mind in case things are questioned - you'll know if you have a cushion to make that change or not.

David




David S. Eldridge, Jr., P.E., LEED AP BD+C, BEMP, BEAP, HBDP
Grumman/Butkus Associates



From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] On Behalf Of James Hansen
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 4:30 PM
To: Nick Caton; Nick Patsos; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>

Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED and Seasonal operation / DHW heater seasonal operation

Recirculation set to 0.01 may be the problem?  Can't you force equipment on/off via load management / scheduling?

Also, like Nick said, there shouldn't be an issue with unoccupied periods for schools, but make sure whoever does your FTE calcs takes that into consideration, and that all Water Efficiency calculations have +/- 40 weeks per year in lieu of 52.

GHT Limited
James Hansen, PE, LEED AP, BEMP
Senior Associate
1110 N. Glebe Road, Suite 300
Arlington, VA 22201
703.243.1200 (main)
703.338.5754 (direct/cell)
www.ghtltd.com<http://www.ghtltd.com>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Nick Caton
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 5:24 PM
To: Nick Patsos; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED and Seasonal operation / DHW heater seasonal operation


1.      I don't think LEED precludes you from modeling a building being unoccupied for a good chunk of the year (assuming baseline and proposed have matching schedules), but I would anticipate this to raise some flags without substantial explanation and backup.  Acquiring something from the district/owner in writing to submit alongside regular documentation to back up your scheduling might save you a headache later.

2.      If there's no pump operation (verified by hourly reports) or scheduled DHW demand, I think that only leaves the pilot light... ?  That would show up as misc. gas consumption by default, if occurring.  You might post your project to get a second set of eyes on the problem.

Hope that helps!

~Nick

[cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB]

NICK CATON, P.E.
SENIOR ENGINEER

Smith & Boucher Engineers
25501 west valley parkway, suite 200
olathe, ks 66061
direct 913.344.0036
fax 913.345.0617
www.smithboucher.com<http://www.smithboucher.com>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Nick Patsos
Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 9:29 AM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: [Equest-users] LEED and Seasonal operation / DHW heater seasonal operation

Hi all,

I'm currently modelling a school building in eQuest for the LEED for Schools 2009 certification. The school doesn't operate at all in the summer season (closed) and so it isn't equipped with equipment for cooling.

I have made schedules modelling this principle (not operating in JUNE/JULY/AUGUST) at both proposed and baseline scenarios but I'm concerned if it is mandatory or not to model a full year's operation under LEED. In the months of operation, I have modelled both cooling/heating as it is mandatory.

A second question is how to make the DHW heater not to operate at the summer months. Having tried everything and after doublechecking that there is no DHW demand from the annual schedule for the summer months, the result is that the DHW loop and pump show no use for these months (seen at the simulation output) but still the DHW heater is operating consuming significant gas for an unknown reason. Loop is set to demand operation and recirculation set at 0.01.

Any help highly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Nikos Patsos
Mechanical Engineer

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