[Bldg-sim] Masonry Heater and LEED

Dahlstrom, Aaron ADahlstrom at in-posse.com
Fri Mar 16 07:36:35 PDT 2012


Karen -

Good question! I have a project right now using a wood stove.

If it's biomass, it technically isn't "fossil fuel", right?

So, whether VRF ("electric") OR biomass ("other") is the predominant heat source, in both cases you'd be up against the right-hand column of Table G3.1.1A for your baseline ... make sense?

Additionally, are you actually modeling the "energy cost" of the masonry heater in the proposed case?
(If so, a whole host of questions follow. Energy rate? Acceptable per LEED to use biomass heaters in model? Mechanism for modeling in eQUEST?) If so, then I believe you would be attempting to show the energy cost difference between heating with wood (eg "Other" fuel source) and heating with an electric single-zone heat pump.

On my job, there is a woodstove and a water source heatpump.

However, the client has indicated that the use of the woodstove will be only occasional, so we are allowing the load to be carried by the water-to-water heat pump only in the proposed case, and the baseline is from the right-hand column of Table G3.1.1A.

Additionally, they have 40+acres, and plan to harvest the wood on-site, so technically there is no cash paid for the woodfuel source ... ie it would only be a savings in the model versus the displaced electric heat pump heat ... so we feel we are conservative in neglecting it. Might be a different story if the client was purchasing their wood. Anyone ever do a calc of $ / BTU from dry hardwood versus natural gas versus heat pump heating?? ;)


Aaron Dahlstrom , PE, LEED(r) AP
In Posse - A subsidiary of AKF| 1500 Walnut Street, Suite 1414, Philadelphia, PA 19102
d: 215-282-6753| m: 267-507-5470| In Posse: 215-282-6800| AKF: 215-735-7290
e: ADahlstrom at in-posse.com | in posse web: www.in-posse.com<http://www.in-posse.com/> | akf web: www.akfgroup.com<http://www.akfgroup.com/>



From: bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Karen Walkerman
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 5:09 PM
To: Jim Dirkes
Cc: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Bldg-sim] Masonry Heater and LEED

a gorgeous way to heat with wood.

http://www.turtlerockheat.com/heaters.html
On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 5:02 PM, Jim Dirkes <jim at buildingperformanceteam.com<mailto:jim at buildingperformanceteam.com>> wrote:
What is a masonry heater?

The Building Performance Team
James V. Dirkes II, P.E., BEMP , LEED AP
1631 Acacia Drive NW
Grand Rapids, MI 49504
616 450 8653<tel:616%20450%208653>

From: bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] On Behalf Of Karen Walkerman
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2012 4:21 PM
To: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: [Bldg-sim] Masonry Heater and LEED

Hi,

I have a LEED project that is utilizing a VRV system to provide heating and cooling.  The building also has a masonry heater that the users will use often as a heat source and for cooking.  I'm completing a LEED model for this project and I'm not sure how to approach the baseline heating systems.  The building has a fully functional VRV system - this would lead to choosing System 4 - PSZ-HP.  However, the users will use the masonry heater for heat whenever they can.  This might lead to choosing System 3, and using a boiler.  Any thoughts or experience with similar projects?

Thanks,

--
Karen



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