[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
[EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Zones without HVAC return nodes
Hello Dr. Li,
Thanks for your detailed response to my question. I need to run some tests to check on how to apply what you suggest.
Yes, the house is in a cold region (southern highlands of Australia) although I have also seen houses in Northen California with the same gas furnace/no AC arrangement.
The system is as you described. There is an inlet and outlet on the furnace.
The return air flows from the rooms into the hall then into a collection vent and through a duct to the inlet of the furnace.
Modeling the hallway as a plenum in the HVAC system, as you suggested, does work.
My problem with using that approach is that I can't find out how to represent, correctly, a plenum in an AirflowNetwork.
The AFN node definitions only allow for a mixer to combine multiple air paths. If I use a mixer object in the AFN I get errors.
So far the only thing that works is to connect the outlet nodes of the zones to the air node in the hallway using ducts. This seems to be a kludge so I don't know whether to trust the results.
Thanks, Andrew.
--- In EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, YuanLu Li <yli006@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hi, Andrew I noticed that you are only using heating, I assume that you do have a cold Winter. In Canada, all the residential house has a basement for water main to enter the house, so that it will not be frozen in Winter. The gas furnace is mounted in the basement. The furnace is rectangular in shape and has two ducts. There will definitely a horizontal one to distribute the warm air, from the top of the furnace box. The return air may enter the box from the bottom where the fan is mounted. I have seen such a picture in the EPlus document. In my condo, there are two ducts at the ceiling level, one for warm air and one for return air.==================For a bungalow, the return duct may not be present. The air flowing down the starcase to the basement and the fan filter is sufficient for the convection flow. The hot air is forced upwards near the wall and windows. Kitchen and bathrooms will have small exhaust fans. You do have a return duct from the hall way. You may ignore this or model it as a zone with air mixing from the other zones, to keep the temperature the same as the other zones. To make it plenum, simply declare this as a zone (plenum) and use it as a mixer of the air loop. You need not have to declare how the room air get into the plenum zone. All the air flow through the ATU's will enter this plenum as return air in simulation. You may declare an additioanal infiltration for air leak to outside air, and add an OA intake with an OA mixer box.. The furnace will have a fresh air piple and a chinmey pipe. These are usually not simulated, although the chimney pipe is suitable to act as inlet air pre-heat.======================In a two or three storey house, part of the partition wall space is used as vertical is used a the return air duct with a grill opening at each upper floor. This is usually away from the stair case and thus have two return parths from the upper floors. The air outlet cover usually has a adjustable slider. This is the EPlus ATU:..:uncontrolled.=======================If you need to study the temperature in the house, then divide the floor area into more zones as the 5Zone exmple model, or in actual room divisions. Rooms without a hot air outlet would be a passive zone. Heating can be assumed to be by wall conduction or with some zone air mixing from the other rooms. How the air is returned from each zone to the furnace is not very emportant. With a constant volume fan, a fixed fraction of this volume enters a zone, and the same amount leave the zone at a different temperature. This heat balance or difference causes the zone temperature to be slightly above or below the controlled AHU supply air temperature.==================Full Airflow network is designed to work with external environment condition as well. The AFN distribution duct network takes into account of duct temperature and pressure changes and pobably the flow between the diffuser and the exhaust ports.======================In the above described case, the room temperature can be observed. The temperature >
> Dr. Li
> To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> From: drajperry@...
> Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2011 12:08:31 +0000
> Subject: [EnergyPlus_Support] Zones without HVAC return nodes
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello All,
>
> I have been trying for some time to model a type of residential house which uses a simple gas furnace for heating.
>
> Heated air from the furnace passes through ducts to the simple delivery terminals (AirTerminal:SingleDuct:Uncontrolled) in each room.
>
>
>
> There are no return air terminals in the rooms. In the real house, the air flows from the rooms through doorways and is collected at a single return vent (usually in a hall) and then through a duct back to the inlet of the furnace.
>
>
>
> The house cannot be modelled as a single zone since important temperature differences between rooms do occur in practice.
>
>
>
> Is there a "right" way to model this in EnergyPlus?
>
> I have made the hall zone a return plenum for all the room zones but that is not really what plenums are for.
>
> In addition if I use a plenum I cannot find documentation or examples on how to handle it in an airflow network so that I can correctly include the airflow through the doors.
>
>
>
> Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Andrew
>
------------------------------------
Primary EnergyPlus support is found at:
http://energyplus.helpserve.com or send a message to energyplus-support@xxxxxxxx
The primary EnergyPlus web site is found at:
http://www.energyplus.gov
The group web site is:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/
Attachments are currently allowed but be mindful that not everyone has a high speed connection. Limit attachments to small files.
EnergyPlus Documentation is searchable. Open EPlusMainMenu.pdf under the Documentation link and press the "search" button.
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/
<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional
<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/join
(Yahoo! ID required)
<*> To change settings via email:
EnergyPlus_Support-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
EnergyPlus_Support-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
EnergyPlus_Support-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/