[Equest-users] Understanding Floors

[Demba Ndiaye]

Peter,

What do you mean by "I can put more than 1 zone into a space"?

Demba.

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Peter Hillermann
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 3:13 PM
To: 'Pasha Korber-Gonzalez'; 'Sami, Vikram'
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

I can put more than 1 zone into a space. When you go to the HVAC tab it will show your building together within that space. The problem I had was overlapping zones, one stacked on top of the other with the same ceiling height so I broke apart my office into 2 different floors as you can see by the images. That's where my question came from.

Thanks,

PETER HILLERMANN

peterh at westallarchitects.com<mailto:peterh at westallarchitects.com>

westall
architects
3404 pierce drive
chamblee, georgia 30341

o 770.458.4113
f  770.458.5352
c 678.898.2936

westallarchitects.com
[cid:image003.jpg at 01CB115D.F51F48D0][cid:image004.gif at 01CB115D.F51F48D0]



From: Pasha Korber-Gonzalez [mailto:pasha.pkconsulting at gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 2:35 PM
To: Sami, Vikram
Cc: Nick Caton; Peter Hillermann; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

I'm with Vik- I thought it was only one space to one zone, but if someone has a new way of things, please share...

pkg
On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 12:11 PM, Sami, Vikram <Vikram.Sami at perkinswill.com<mailto:Vikram.Sami at perkinswill.com>> wrote:
Nick,
How do you group multiple spaces in one zone? I always thought you could do only one space per zone.

[cid:image005.jpg at 01CB115D.F51F48D0]

Vikram Sami, LEED AP
Sustainable Design Analyst
1382 Peachtree St. NE, Atlanta, GA 30309
t: 404-443-7462    f: 404.892.5823       e: vikram.sami at perkinswill.com<mailto:vikram.sami at perkinswill.com>   www.perkinswill.com<http://www.perkinswill.com/>
Perkins+Will.  Ideas + buildings that honor the broader goals of society


From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] On Behalf Of Nick Caton
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 2:00 PM

To: Peter Hillermann; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

Hey Peter,

If by "stack" you mean place one space geometrically over another, the answer is yes.  If you mean to ask whether zones can group spaces in different elevations, the answer is also yes.

However, I would like to hammer out your wording again to be sure we're on the same page!  I think you meant to ask "Can you stack a space in a shell?"  Spaces are normally "inside" shells in a geometrical sense, as they are generally within the shell footprint/boundaries.

Zones, in contrast, have nothing to do with geometries - they are simply groupings of spaces with some extra HVAC/airflow properties tacked on.  Those spaces could be all over the place - at different elevations, within different shells... pretty much any combination from my experience.

Best of luck!  If you are getting tripped up, remember a picture is worth a thousand questions (?)...

~Nick

PS to all:  The SD/DD Wizards are, in my mind, kinda misleading with regard to helping new users understand the distinction between "space" & "zone."  Some work in detailed mode will eventually lead you to understand, but the Wizard screens inconsistently interchange the terms and may cause others confusion in the long run... See my description below for a simple breakdown if you are cutting your teeth on eQuest ;).

[cid:image006.jpg at 01CB115D.F51F48D0]

NICK CATON, E.I.T.
PROJECT ENGINEER
25501 west valley parkway
olathe ks 66061
direct 913 344.0036
fax 913 345.0617
Check out our new web-site @ www.smithboucher.com<http://www.smithboucher.com/>

From: Peter Hillermann [mailto:peterh at westallarchitects.com<mailto:peterh at westallarchitects.com>]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 12:40 PM
To: Nick Caton; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: RE: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

Nick,

Thanks again. Can you stack a space in a zone?

Thanks,

PETER HILLERMANN

peterh at westallarchitects.com<mailto:peterh at westallarchitects.com>

westall
architects
3404 pierce drive
chamblee, georgia 30341

o 770.458.4113
f  770.458.5352
c 678.898.2936

westallarchitects.com<http://westallarchitects.com/>

From: Nick Caton [mailto:ncaton at smithboucher.com<mailto:ncaton at smithboucher.com>]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 12:33 PM
To: Peter Hillermann; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: RE: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

Peter, I think you might be leading yourself into some unnecessary confusion with your word choices...

eQuest has 3 distinct entities:

-          Shells are simply groups of spaces

-          Spaces are geometrical volumes, which may or may not have floors, walls, ceilings, windows, etc. tied to them.  Internal loads / daylighting / occupancies are attributed to spaces.

-          Zones are simple entities that include one or more spaces, with additional HVAC attributes like thermostat and airflow specifics.

You're using "floors" to interchangeable discuss all the above, it seems.  For clarity when discussing eQuest, "floors" are merely the constructions we walk on, normally one attribute of a "space."

All that said, it's entirely possible to model a "box within a box," as you're describing.  You are limited in the wizards (by their nature) with regard to defining zones/footprints... the best approach depends on the nature of the space footprints you want to model.  If it's very simply two stacked cubes enclosed within a larger cube, I'd personally model one shell, with one space carved out of the middle.  Then I'd use the detailed mode to shrink that space volume and partition/ceiling dimensions to match the first floor office, then copy the entire space and its componenents for the second floor.  I'd adjust the largest cube's volume (it's a space property) to correct the conditioned volume, and be sure all partitions are correctly associating the three spaces together...  With all spaces sorted out, ensure your three spaces are correctly grouped with regard to "zones," for association with your HVAC system(s).

Clear as mud =)?

~Nick

[cid:image006.jpg at 01CB115D.F51F48D0]

NICK CATON, E.I.T.
PROJECT ENGINEER
25501 west valley parkway
olathe ks 66061
direct 913 344.0036
fax 913 345.0617
Check out our new web-site @ www.smithboucher.com<http://www.smithboucher.com/>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org>] On Behalf Of Peter Hillermann
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 10:56 AM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: [Equest-users] Understanding Floors

To All,

I just want to make sure I understand the properties behind floors. If you have a square building volume with a smaller square inside it that has 2 levels. EG:- an atrium as main space with 2 levels that are offices. There will be a total of 3 floors in your model. Atrium floor, first floor office and second floor office. Each of these will have a designated floor to floor height. You cannot put one zone inside another on the same floor.

Is this correct?

Thanks,

PETER HILLERMANN

peterh at westallarchitects.com<mailto:peterh at westallarchitects.com>

westall
architects
3404 pierce drive
chamblee, georgia 30341

o 770.458.4113
f  770.458.5352
c 678.898.2936

westallarchitects.com<http://westallarchitects.com/>
[cid:image003.jpg at 01CB115D.F51F48D0][cid:image004.gif at 01CB115D.F51F48D0]


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