[Equest-users] LEED Core & Shell questions

Mickey Bush mbush at dmiinc.com
Tue Aug 6 09:06:27 PDT 2013


I have a specific application related to the questions posed by David.

 

Proposed System - We have a core and shell project that includes a central
CHW and HW plant as well as a dedicated outdoor air unit (with energy
recovery). The design intent is to support tenant installation of fan coil
units with outside air ducted to the spaces from the DOAS unit. 

 

Baseline System - Based on the building size the baseline system is System 7
- VAV with reheat.

 

Questions:

1.       What should be modeled as the tenant HVAC system in the proposed
model? One approach is to use fan coil units to align with the design
intent. But, this thread has recommended using the Appendix G baseline for
the tenant space, which in our case would be System 7 - VAV with reheat.

2.       If we model fan coil units, should we follow appendix G specifics
for fan power and other operating parameters despite the fact that fan coil
units are not specifically an option in Appendix G?

3.       I believe the tenant design is complete (or nearly complete) with
fan coil units. Should we make use of the tenant drawings to model the HVAC
system? (The tenant design is under a separate contract.)

 

Thanks,

Mickey

 

Mickey Bush, PE, LEED AP

DMI

300 Chestnut Street Suite 150

Needham, MA 02492

Phone: 781-449-5700 x13

 

From: Ellis, David [mailto:David.Ellis at hdrinc.com] 
Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 3:02 PM
To: Patrick J. O'Leary, Jr.
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED Core & Shell questions

 

If the shell space is not yet fully designed, the understood guidance is
that the ASHRAE baseline system is to be used for the shell spaces. My
question is if the shell space intended design approach is evident (by
system infrastructure installed to support future tenants) via lease
documents, has anyone been required to prove the intended system approach
performance as well?

 

Thanks

 


David Ellis
PE (VA, MD, DC)

LEED AP

CEM

PMP

HDR Architecture Inc
Energy Services, New Construction


1101 King Street, Suite 400  | Alexandria, VA 22314
703.647.7735 | c: 703.343.6758
 <mailto:first.last at hdrinc.com> David.Ellis at hdrinc.com |
<http://www.hdrinc.com/markets/architecture> hdrarchitecture.com

 <http://www.facebook.com/HDRarchitecture> Description:
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Description:
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ns/gray_architizer24.jpg

 

 

From: Patrick J. O'Leary, Jr. [mailto:poleary1969 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 2:36 PM
To: Ellis, David
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED Core & Shell questions

 

what do you mean by "if the building approach for tenant fit-out defines a
tenant design approach which is different from the baseline..." ?

for leed purposes if the building approach for tenant fit-out is NOT  leed
compliant per the appendix 4 quote below (or CS grey box at top of page 274
of the 2009 edition of the leed reference guide) then the 90.1 baseline must
be used in both proposed and baseline.  

either the design approach is different from the baseline and complies with
the requirements mentioned (appendix 4/page 274 of 2009 edition) or it is
not & the baseline must be used in both the proposed and baseline
simulations (no savings claimed by whatever is actually in the design
approach that does not meet the leed requirements for sale/lease
agreements).

my edition of the 2009 edition, page 274, CS grey box title is:  Credit for
Tenant-implement Efficiency Measures.  it is in the eac1 section, right
after the large requirement table in section 6. calculations.

On 8/5/13 7:07 AM, Ellis, David wrote: 

Anthony, Patrick, Bill and the list,

 

I too have a keen interest in answering the question below (which might only
be answered by USGBC):

 

Per the C&S Appendix 2 guidance (reference noted in Bill's original question
below), 

.         "The core and shell building is defined as the parts of the
building that are not tenant space. Any constraints or guidance issued to
the tenant, such as a maximum level of lighting density or restrictions on
occupancy type, must be outlined in the tenant lease or sales agreement (see
Appendix 4)."

.         "Model the heating, ventilation, and air-conditioning (HVAC)
system as described in the design documents. If the HVAC system is not yet
designed, use the same HVAC system as the baseline model, per
ANSI/ASHRAE/IESNA Standard 90.1-2007, Table G3.1.1A."

.         "If the team is pursuing any additional energy-saving
opportunities not associated with the core and shell areas, outline the
opportunities or requirements in the tenant lease or sales agreement (see
Appendix 4)."

 

And Appendix 4 (
<http://www.usgbc.org/resources/appendix-4-tenant-lease-or-sales-agreement>
http://www.usgbc.org/resources/appendix-4-tenant-lease-or-sales-agreement ),

.         "Compliance through a binding tenant lease or sales agreement can
be pursued as an alternative to or in conjunction with the standard approach
to LEED for Core & Shell credit documentation. Clearly identify which
components of the credit will be implemented as part of the developer's
scope of work, and which portions will be part of the tenants' scope of work
and enforced through binding tenant lease or sales agreements."

 

Per guidance above, for spaces not yet designed ASHRAE Baseline is to be
presumed, unless specific measures are designed in that enhance the baseline
approach. If those measures are in the C&S design intended for tenant use,
then they must be included in any binding lease agreement material (such as
sales information or design guideline/specification).

 

What is not clear is if the building approach for tenant fit-out defines a
tenant design approach which is different from the baseline. Does anyone
have experience with being required to show that the defined approach also
performs?

 

Regards,

Dave

 


David Ellis
PE (VA, MD, DC)

LEED AP

CEM

PMP

HDR Architecture Inc
Energy Services, New Construction


1101 King Street, Suite 400  | Alexandria, VA 22314
703.647.7735 | c: 703.343.6758
 <mailto:first.last at hdrinc.com> David.Ellis at hdrinc.com |
<http://www.hdrinc.com/markets/architecture> hdrarchitecture.com

 <http://www.facebook.com/HDRarchitecture> Description:
http://images.publicaster.com/ImageLibrary/account2803/images/SocialMediaIco
ns/gray_facebook.jpg    <http://twitter.com/#%21/HDRArchitecture>
Description:
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ns/gray_twitter.jpg    <http://www.youtube.com/user/HDRarchitecture>
Description:
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ns/gray_youtube.jpg    <http://www.flickr.com/photos/hdrarchitecture/sets/>
Description:
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ns/gray_flickr.jpg
<http://www.architizer.com/en_us/firms/view/hdr-architecture/8916/>
Description:
http://images.publicaster.com/ImageLibrary/account2803/images/SocialMediaIco
ns/gray_architizer24.jpg

 

 

From: Patrick J. O'Leary, Jr. [mailto:poleary1969 at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 01, 2013 5:37 PM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] LEED Core & Shell questions

 

i don't recall the page in the leed 3 manual right off hand but 1)  tenant
spaces can be modeled as proposed type (hvac/water/lighting) if there is a
legally binding signed/or master lease agreement specifying the proposed
requirements that all tenants must adhere to and said lease agreement is
uploaded as part of the project documentation.  i.e. lower lighting lpd,
increased hvac unit efficiencies/power, and water saving fixtures.  

and 2)  there is an equest limit on the number of submeters a project can
have, and a core/shell project requires submeters for each tenant to be
separated out between process, lighting, and hvac, so the number of meters
can add up quickly if you're dealing with a sizeable core/shell with many
tenant spaces.

On 8/1/13 1:36 PM, Anthony Hardman wrote: 

See below

 

Anthony Hardman, PE, LEED AP BD&C

Building Performance Analyst

The Green Engineer, Inc.

Sustainable Design Consulting

54 Junction Square Dr.

Concord, MA 01742

O: (978) 610-2801

C: (720) 840-7862

 

The Green Engineer, Inc. is a Certified B Corporation

 

From: Bishop, Bill [mailto:bbishop at pathfinder-ea.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 01, 2013 7:11 AM
To: eQUEST Users List
Subject: [Equest-users] LEED Core & Shell questions

 

1. Should Tenant Spaces in LEED Core & Shell projects be modeled with
Appendix G systems for the Baseline, and for the Proposed as well if there
is no HVAC design?

-OR- Should Tenant Spaces be modeled as "unconditioned" in both the Baseline
and Proposed? (-OR- some other option?)

 

Finished tenant spaces should be modeled as designed with terminal units
placed on the tenant meter.  If unfinished, it should follow Appendix G.

 

2. What is the intent/purpose of the requirement to model separate electric
meters for lighting, plug loads and process loads in the Tenant Spaces?
Should the cost from these meters be removed from the building energy cost
for EAc1 savings?

 

Download the spreadsheet
<http://www.usgbc.org/resources/cs-v20-eac1-spreadsheet> , it should answer
your questions.

 

3. IF HVAC systems are modeled in the Tenant Spaces, should this energy be
assigned to separate meters as well?

 

LEED Core
<http://www.usgbc.org/resources/appendix-2-core-and-shell-energy-modeling-gu
idelines> & Shell Appendix 2 describes how the HVAC systems should be
modeled for the Core and Shell Building, but not for the Tenant Spaces.
Appendix 2 also describes the requirement for modeling separate meters.

 

Thank you,

Bill 

 

 

William Bishop, PE, BEMP, BEAP, LEED AP | Pathfinder Engineers & Architects
LLP

Oh No Mr
Bill.jpgSenior Energy Engineer

 

134 South Fitzhugh Street                 Rochester, NY 14608

T: (585) 325-6004 Ext. 114            F: (585) 325-6005

 <mailto:wbishop at pathfinder-ea.com> bbishop at pathfinder-ea.com
<http://www.pathfinder-ea.com/> www.pathfinder-ea.com

P   Sustainability - the forest AND the trees. P   

 

 






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