[Equest-users] Oversized cooling
Joe Huang
yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com
Mon Dec 1 16:36:34 PST 2014
So the LS-C peak load is actually even lower than on the SS-D. This
will take more investigation. Could you send the BDL file to me? I
won't get to it till the weekend, though.
Joe
On 12/1/2014 4:00 PM, Gonzalo Lema wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
> Thanks again for your help
>
> The Peak cooling load is 68 tons :
>
> So I still don’t get why the cooling capacity is 629 tons
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Gonzalo Lema | Mechanical Engineer | LEED GA*
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 Ext 7009 (Chicago, USA)
>
> Tel: +1.305.814.8805 (Miami, USA)
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> glema at sumacinc.com <mailto:glema at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *From:*Joe Huang [mailto:yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com]
> *Sent:* Monday, December 01, 2014 5:43 PM
> *To:* Gonzalo Lema
> *Cc:* equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Equest-users] Oversized cooling
>
> Gonzalo,
>
> The answer to your question, I believe, lies in the
>
> second longer part of my answer, i.e., the difference
>
> between LOADS loads at a fixed reference temperature
>
> and no OA and the SYSTEM loads at the actual room temperature
>
> with those factors taken into account. For the mild California
>
> climate that you simulated, these effects are quite considerable.
>
> Without sounding like a nag, please look at the LOADS report
>
> for the peak cooling load.
>
>
>
> Everyone should be duly impressed that this reply is being sent by IPhone
>
> from a hotel lobby in Shanghai China...
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Joe Huang
>
> White Box Technologies
>
> 346 Rheem Blvd Suite 108D
>
> Moraga CA 94556
>
> (o) 1(925)388-0265
>
> (c) 1(510)928-2683
>
> yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com <mailto:yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com>
>
>
> On Dec 1, 2014, at 11:29 PM, Gonzalo Lema <GLema at sumacinc.com
> <mailto:GLema at sumacinc.com>> wrote:
>
> Hi Joe,
>
> I also believe that the fan size is probably determined by the
> maximum heating, not the cooling, load. However, I don’t
> understand why after determining the airflow, it doesn’t adjust
> the cooling coil to have a similar capacity as the building HVAC
> maximum cooling load (SS-D report).
>
> Would you like to see the input/output files?
>
> Thanks for your help
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Gonzalo Lema | Mechanical Engineer | LEED GA*
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 Ext 7009 (Chicago, USA)
>
> Tel: +1.305.814.8805 (Miami, USA)
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> glema at sumacinc.com <mailto:glema at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *From:* Equest-users
> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] *On Behalf Of
> *Joe Huang
> *Sent:* Wednesday, November 26, 2014 3:05 PM
> *To:* equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
> <mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Equest-users] Oversized cooling
>
> Without looking at the DOE-2.2 input and output files, it's
> difficult to give you a definitive answer, but from my experience
> explanations for such sizing questions can always be found with a
> little digging and understanding of how DOE-2 does autosizing.
>
> When DOE-2 does autosizing, it takes the maximum loads reported
> from LOADS and calculates the equipment capacity (heating,
> cooling, and fan) needed to meet those loads. The fact that the
> building is in a cool climate (Colorado Springs) has several
> implications on the sizing calculation - (1) fan size is probably
> determined by the maximum heating, not the cooling, load, (2) fan
> size will also be increased significantly (1.24) due to the
> altitude, (3) substantial difference between the peak cooling load
> from LOADS and SYSTEMS, since the former is derived at a constant
> reference temperature with no outside air, while the latter is
> derived at the actual zone temperature and with outside air (e.g.,
> economizer running earlier in the day, etc.). To trace these
> differences, compare the peak loads in the LOADS reports to those
> in the SYSTEM reports.
>
> Joe
>
> Joe Huang
> White Box Technologies, Inc.
> 346 Rheem Blvd., Suite 205A
> Moraga CA 94556
> yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com
> <mailto:yjhuang at whiteboxtechnologies.com>
> http://weather.whiteboxtechnologies.com for simulation-ready
> weather data
> http://www.whiteboxtechnologies.com
> (o) (925)388-0265
> (c) (510)928-2683
> "building energy simulations at your fingertips"
>
>
> On 11/25/2014 11:18 AM, Sami, Vikram wrote:
>
> Curious.
>
> I do think the higher load seems to be more like what you
> should expect for a building this size (7501 kBTU/h = 625
> tons. For a 102,000 ft2 building that’s 163 ft2/ton). That
> might be slightly oversized for Ft Carson, although Colorado
> springs gets hot in the summer. Not sure what your building
> loads are, but 163 ft2/ton is not unheard of for a heavy use
> building. I would expect something more in the range of
> 250-300. So the question is why is the maximum cooling load
> reporting as only 927 kBTU/hr (77.25 tons = 1320 ft2/ton)
>
> Just my two cents from looking at this for five minutes – I
> might be wrong.
>
> *Vikram Sami*
> BEMP, LEED BD+C
> Associate Partner
>
>
>
>
>
> ZGF ARCHITECTS LLP
> *T *206.521.3509 *E *vikram.sami at zgf.com
> <mailto:vikram.sami at zgf.com>
> 925 Fourth Avenue, Suite 2400
> Seattle, WA 98104
>
> *From:* Equest-users
> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] *On Behalf
> Of *Gonzalo Lema
> *Sent:* Monday, November 24, 2014 12:25 PM
> *To:* equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
> <mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
> *Subject:* [Equest-users] Oversized cooling
>
> Hi,
>
> I have a problem with the cooling capacity. The Max cooling
> load is 927 kbtu/hr, but the cooling capacity is 7501 kbtu/h.
> I auto-sized the equipment (system and cooling coil) for 1.00,
> but I don’t understand why the factor seems to be 8x.
>
> <image001.jpg>
>
> <image002.png>
>
> The system fan Works in part-load 0-20% all the time:
>
> <image003.png>
>
> Does anybody knows what could be causing this?
>
> **
>
> Thanks.
>
> **
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Gonzalo Lema | Mechanical Engineer | LEED GA*
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 Ext 7009 (Chicago, USA)
>
> Tel: +1.305.814.8805 (Miami, USA)
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> glema at sumacinc.com <mailto:glema at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *From:* Dante Garcia
> *Sent:* Monday, November 24, 2014 10:24 AM
> *To:* Gonzalo Lema
> *Subject:* RE: eQuest - Fort Cartson
>
> Hola Gonzalo, no he podido encontrar el error hasta el viernes
> que estuve avanzando.
>
> Ahora he estado con otras prioridades, mañana puedo volver a
> revisar el proyecto.
>
> Saludos,
>
> Dante
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Dante Garcia, LEED AP BD+C | Analista LEED Energía*
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 Anexo 16 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Cel: +51.989.685.769 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 (Chicago, USA)
>
> dgarcia at sumacinc.com <mailto:dgarcia at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *De:*Gonzalo Lema
> *Enviado el:* lunes, 24 de noviembre de 2014 11:17 a.m.
> *Para:* Dante Garcia
> *Asunto:* RE: eQuest - Fort Cartson
>
> Buen día,
>
> ¿Alguna novedad?
>
> Yo sigo revisando también.
>
> Saludos
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Gonzalo Lema | Mechanical Engineer | LEED GA*
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 Ext 7009 (Chicago, USA)
>
> Tel: +1.305.814.8805 (Miami, USA)
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> glema at sumacinc.com <mailto:glema at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *From:* Gonzalo Lema
> *Sent:* Friday, November 21, 2014 5:52 PM
> *To:* Dante Garcia
> *Subject:* RE: eQuest - Fort Cartson
>
> Como va?
>
> Encontraste algo mas?
>
> Buen finde.
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Gonzalo Lema | Mechanical Engineer | LEED GA*
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 Ext 7009 (Chicago, USA)
>
> Tel: +1.305.814.8805 (Miami, USA)
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> glema at sumacinc.com <mailto:glema at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com/>
>
> *From:* Dante Garcia
> *Sent:* Thursday, November 20, 2014 5:21 PM
> *To:* Gonzalo Lema
> *Subject:* eQuest - Fort Cartson
>
> Gonzalo, te envío el eQuest que revisé, todavía no encuentro
> el error, solo edité un poco el primer piso ya que dos zonas
> se sobreponían, mañana seguré revisando y ver si encuentro
> algo, una consulta, viste este reporte, así son los cfm que
> deben tener cada zona o es bien alto?
>
> Saludos,
>
> Dante
>
> <image004.jpg>
>
> *SUMAC*
>
> *Dante Garcia, LEED AP BD+C | Analista LEED Energía*
>
> Tel: +511.253.5355 Anexo 16 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Cel: +51.989.685.769 (Lima, Perú)
>
> Tel: +593.4.600.0613 (Guayaquil, Ecuador)
> Tel: + 571.3151985 (Bogotá, Colombia)
>
> Tel: +1.773.857.7906 (Chicago, USA)
>
> dgarcia at sumacinc.com <mailto:dgarcia at sumacinc.com>
>
> www.sumacinc.com <http://www.sumacinc.com>
>
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> <https://www.zgf.com/ZGF_Email_Disclaimer.html>
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>
>
>
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