[Bldg-sim] LEED, Process energy and pools

James V Dirkes II, PE jvd2pe at tds.net
Fri Jun 25 13:30:53 PDT 2010

I guess that the crucial assumption is whether all the dehumidification,
reheat ,etc. is "maintaining comfort".  Initially, I thought that because it
was far more than "just" comfort, it had to be considered process.  Maybe I
was wrong. For my client's sake, I hope so!


Thanks to several of you who have responded! 


The Building Performance Team
James V. Dirkes II, P.E., LEED AP
1631 Acacia Drive NW
Grand Rapids, MI 49504
616 450 8653


From: Rosenberg, Michael I [mailto:michael.rosenberg at pnl.gov] 
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 4:01 PM
To: James V Dirkes II, PE; bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: RE: [Bldg-sim] LEED, Process energy and pools




I don't think I agree with you that all swimming pool related energy is a
process load according to 90.1. The definition in 90.1 is as follows:


process energy: energy consumed in support of a manufacturing, industrial,
or commercial process other than conditioning spaces and maintaining comfort
and amenities for the occupants of a building.


Clearly controlling space and pool water temperature in a natatorium
maintains comfort for the occupants of a building. Additionally, 90.1
specifically includes many swimming pool related requirements including;


.         Section - pool heaters

.         Section - pool covers

.         Section - time switches

.         Table 7.8 - pool heater efficiency requirements

.         Section - Exhaust Air Energy Recovery (does not
specifically mention swimming pools, but should apply).





Michael Rosenberg 
Senior Commercial Buildings Energy Analyst 

Pacific Northwest National Laboratory 
2032 Todd Street 
Eugene, OR 97405 
(541) 844-1960 
michael.rosenberg at pnl.gov 

From: bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of James V Dirkes
Sent: Friday, June 25, 2010 11:16 AM
To: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: [Bldg-sim] LEED, Process energy and pools


Dear Bldg-Sim community,


I've just completed a lovely, accurate, comprehensive building energy model
(in Energy Plus) which contains an indoor swimming pool.  The building is
about 100,000 square feet and the pool area is about 10% of that total.


At the end of the year, the heating, cooling, fans and pumps associated with
the pool have consumed 70% of the total building energy!  I was rather
surprised.  I expected it to be a large percentage, but not THAT large!
This, by the way, is the result when using a specialty pool HVAC unit which
recovers and re-uses most of the DX cooling energy and thus greatly reduces
the pool energy total.


As far as I can tell, ALL of the pool-related energy is considered by ASHRAE
90.1 and LEED to be "process" energy.  Since "process" energy must be
identical in both the baseline and proposed models, the rest of the building
must accomplish the entire savings . which is pretty darn difficult
(impossible, really) if "process" is too large a percentage.


Have any of you successfully modeled a building with a pool and also
received LEED certification?  If so, can you suggest what I might be


Thanks in advance.


BPT BizCard_RGB_0507


Quid est hoc ad aeternitatem?


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