[Equest-users] Cooling/Heating Capacity Ratios - LEED Report?

[Nick Caton]

Oh, I suppose I should clarify the project in question was submitted and the EAc1 credit was marked 'complete' > 1 year ago, and is only now being reviewed, so the associated EAp2 spreadsheet issn't nearly so far along in development as what you'd encounter under a current project!

If anyone else should has to answer to the same commentary in any case, seems pretty universal to respond in kind with screenshots of the input fields.

~Nick
[cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB]

NICK CATON, P.E.
SENIOR ENGINEER

Smith & Boucher Engineers
25501 west valley parkway, suite 200
olathe, ks 66061
direct 913.344.0036
fax 913.345.0617
www.smithboucher.com

From: James Hansen [mailto:JHANSEN at ghtltd.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 12:02 PM
To: Nick Caton; James Hess; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: RE: [Equest-users] Cooling/Heating Capacity Ratios - LEED Report?

I don't think I have an answer to your question, but wanted to point out two things:

1)  Energy models are often the "property" of the design engineer, modeler, owner, etc, and although I often upload PDFs of the .inp file (because I'm lazy), GBCI should never be able to require this as standard practice.

and

2)  I thought the whole intent of those newer Section 1.4 excel sheets for documenting inputs / outputs is to avoid comments like the one you received.  If you had marked those particular cells of the "General HVAC" tab as follows:

All Baseline system cooling capacities auto-sized with 15% oversizing per G3.1.2.2 (at the system or plant level, but not both)

Yes

All Baseline system heating capacities auto-sized with 25% oversizing per G3.1.2.2 (at the system or plant level, but not both)

Yes


Shouldn't that be enough for the reviewer?  Thought it was supposed to make their job easier....

Were you using an older method of input documentation?

GHT Limited
James Hansen, P.E., LEED AP
Senior Associate
1010 N. Glebe Road, Suite 200
Arlington, VA  22201-4749
703-243-1200 (office)
703-338-5754 (cell)
703-276-1376 (fax)
www.ghtltd.com<http://www.ghtltd.com/>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Nick Caton
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 12:43 PM
To: James Hess; equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Cooling/Heating Capacity Ratios - LEED Report?

Thanks fellas!

I've done screengrabs often in the past and am comfortable that will satisfy the reviewer's concerns in this case, it just bugs me that where I'm confident the inputs are correct, the output reports aren't backing me up as expected...

I've also tried summing together space peak loads from the LS reports for a given system (shaky proposition anyway as they occur at different times), and still cannot find the calculated sizing to line up with my input ratios.  I guess this boils down to something I don't understand yet about how the oversizing ratios are applied to arrive at the calculated system capacities...  Further digging in the help files when I get time I suppose.

I don't anticipate having a problem with this review, but if anyone can fill in the gaps that would be much appreciated =)!

~Nick

PS:  I didn't know others are uploading their entire models...  In the reviewer's shoes, I wonder if that makes any combination of specific reports/information look suspect in comparison?

[cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB]

NICK CATON, P.E.
SENIOR ENGINEER

Smith & Boucher Engineers
25501 west valley parkway, suite 200
olathe, ks 66061
direct 913.344.0036
fax 913.345.0617
www.smithboucher.com<http://www.smithboucher.com>

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of James Hess
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 10:52 AM
To: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Cooling/Heating Capacity Ratios - LEED Report?

Same here regarding the screen shots, but I only provide if asked to specifically document something via review comments.  On every submitted project, however, I always upload the eQuest .inp and .pd2 files so that the reviewers can just open the files and look at whatever they need to.  That beats submitting reams of "input reports" which really isn't practical.  I'm assuming the reviewers know eQuest enough such that if they want to verify the Cool Sizing Ratio or Heat Sizing Ratio, they know exactly where to go in eQuest to find the answers, in a matter of seconds.  That seems like a pretty reasonable assumption to me.

Regards,

JAH

James A. Hess, PE, CEM, BEMP
Energy Engineer
TME, Inc.
Little Rock, AR
Mobile: (501) 351-4667

From: equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org> [mailto:equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Neil Bulger
Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013 6:02 PM
To: Patrick J. O'Leary, Jr.
Cc: equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org<mailto:equest-users at lists.onebuilding.org>
Subject: Re: [Equest-users] Cooling/Heating Capacity Ratios - LEED Report?

I second Patrick, typically I just provide screen grabs of the baseline model and send it off.


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Integral Group | 427 13th Street | Oakland CA USA 94612
T 510.663.2070 x235

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On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 1:19 PM, Patrick J. O'Leary, Jr. <poleary1969 at gmail.com<mailto:poleary1969 at gmail.com>> wrote:
i typically just do screen caps when setting up my baseline model.  it's quick, painless, and makes mothers very happy ... and is done early ...

yeah, one would think there would be a details of hvac systems output report showing the direct inputs, but there's not.  unless you're good at creating custom reports & can create one that pulls input data from the hvac section?  if that's even data possible for equest to pull ...

or you could parse the info from the .sim file keying on just the = system name, heat-sizing-rati & cool-sizing-rati variables.

"PSZ-1" = SYSTEM
   TYPE             = PSZ
   HEAT-SOURCE      = FURNACE
   ZONE-HEAT-SOURCE = NONE
   BASEBOARD-SOURCE = NONE
   SIZING-RATIO     = 1.15
   HEAT-SIZING-RATI = 1.25
   COOL-SIZING-RATI = 1.15
  etc ........



On 4/10/13 1:04 PM, Nick Caton wrote:
Hi folks,

I have a seemingly simple LEED comment which has been causing me to chase my tail this afternoon.  I feel like this should be really easy to document in a crystal-clear fashion, but I must be missing something:

The Task:
Document with clarity that the baseline system cooling and heating capacities are using the 1.15 and 1.25 (respectively) capacity sizing ratios as prescribed in 90.1 Appendix G.

Intuitively, I have a sense we should be able to simply and directly reference one or a series of the *.SIM reports to substantiate the systems are oversized by the appropriate factors.  After spending some time digging through the reports and associated help documentation however, I'm empty-handed and do not think the actual ratio inputs (COOL-SIZING-RATI / HEAT-SIZING-RATI) are reported.

Further, I tried deriving the oversizing ratio between a system's annual PEAK  (re: report SS-P) and calculated system capacity (report SV-A) as reported... but the math doesn't quite work out!  It's the right ballpark, but I don't think I can write the difference off as a rounding error...

The Solution(?):
For now, I can just provide screen grabs illustrating the inputs in eQuest's spreadsheet view with relative ease, but if this is possible to document by assembling/referencing one or more additional reports for future models I'd prefer to adopt that in practice and avoid the same question down the road.  If I have some misunderstanding or new nuance to learn about the reports that would be worthwhile as well =).

Any suggestions/experience?

Thanks in advance!

~Nick



NICK CATON, P.E.
SENIOR ENGINEER

Smith & Boucher Engineers
25501 west valley parkway, suite 200
olathe, ks 66061
direct 913.344.0036
fax 913.345.0617
www.smithboucher.com<http://www.smithboucher.com>



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