[Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a GUI

Paul Carey paul at zed-uk.com
Fri Oct 30 03:26:34 PDT 2009


Nick,

 

Sorry if I gave the impression I'm not interested in or appreciate
aesthetics.  I actually see my role as marrying architecture and engineering
so I need to understand both.  I was just trying to think about the maths
side of it.  Many times I have received a sketchup model from an architect
and it is nigh-on impossible to use for modelling and simulation use as it's
just too fancy (for want of a better phrase).

 

I agree everyone welcome here.  I was just making some comments too.

 

Cheers

Paul

 

 

From: Nick Caton [mailto:ncaton at smithboucher.com] 
Sent: 30 October 2009 01:19
To: Paul Carey; EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com;
bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: RE: [Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a
GUI

 

Paul et al,

 

Apologies if my comments were misconstrued either as a bash against
Designbuilder or a sales pitch for Sketchup.  My post was and is intended to
clarify Sketchup's current .dwg file support and the related cost
implications.  I personally am in full support of any and all
options/progress/market competition as necessary to advance the science of
building energy modeling.

 

Both Sketchup (in tandem with a variety of plugins and external software)
and Designbuilder are unique and powerful tools that each do a variety of
specific things very well.  

 

".but let's face it, as building physicists we're generally not interested
in architectural fancifulness.  We are interested in boxes (well more or
less) that make the maths quicker. "

 

To be fair, sometimes the task-at-hand does call for a bit of "architectural
fancifulness," such as when presenting results of preliminary massing
studies to an architect/client!  From my perspective, Sketchup and
Designbuilder both have a definite advantage over some of the "for-cost"
competition in this regard.

 

I'd also like to kindly clarify for any newer subscribers:  you don't have
to be a hardcore physicist with zero aesthetic inclinations to participate
in [bldg-sim] or other onebuilding.org mailing lists!  I've only been
subscribed for a year, but it's apparent that experienced and inexperienced
energy simulation enthusiasts alike are welcome from all walks of the
academic world and design industry.

 

~Nick

 

cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB

 

NICK CATON, E.I.T.

PROJECT ENGINEER

25501 west valley parkway

olathe ks 66061

direct 913 344.0036

fax 913 345.0617

Check out our new web-site @ www.smithboucher.com 

 

From: Paul Carey [mailto:paul at zed-uk.com] 
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 5:04 PM
To: Nick Caton; 'Kevin Kyte'; 'Jackson, Alan';
EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Cc: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: RE: [Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a
GUI

 

Nick et al,

 

I still think DesignBuilder offers good value for money when you compare it
to the cost of the pro-version of sketch-up.  It imports dxf, pdf, tiff,
bmp, jpg (for 2d extruded modelling) & gbxml (for 3d importing).  Ok,
perhaps it isn't quite as pretty as SketchUp in places, but let's face it,
as building physicists we're generally not interested in architectural
fancifulness.  We are interested in boxes (well more or less) that make the
maths quicker.  DesignBuilder does all that just the same.  It also has the
advantage of the CFD tool module that allows you to look more closely
airflow distribution based on the results from your EnergyPlus simulations
which are directly linked if you want them to be and produces mean age of
air results, that you could use for other ventilation & comfort analysis.

 

Just my tuppence/2 cents worth.

Cheers

Paul

 

 




Dr Paul Carey

BSc (Hons) PhD FRSA

Director

Low Carbon Energy Assessor

 

Zero Energy Design Ltd

10A Portland Place

2-22 Mottram Road

Stalybridge

SK15 3AD

 


T:  0161 3386200

F:  0161 3031281

M: 0789 4098012

E:  paul at zed-uk.com

W:  www.zed-uk.com

 


 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 


 



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From: bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Nick Caton
Sent: 29 October 2009 21:41
To: Kevin Kyte; Jackson, Alan; EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Cc: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a
GUI

 

The current version of free sketchup (as of this month I believe) does not
support .dwg importing, actually.  If you continue using any older version -
it shouldn't lose this functionality (keep your installation files).  The
Sketchup development team has been clear on their intent to continue .dwg
and other proprietary format file support in the Pro version.  

 

**A moment on my soapbox**

 

Our office took this as a cue to recognize that the free version of Sketchup
is explicitly intended for educational/trial purposes, however powerful it
may be - not for professional design use.  Our office purchased a Pro
license in response to ensure continued support of import/export of .dwg and
other formats we use.  I'd encourage others on bldg-sim to consider this
carefully.  The cost:benefit ratio of the free version of Sketchup, for many
of us, is pretty extraordinary.  To top it off it's actually fairly
inexpensive as far as professional design tools go. 

 

**Stepping off the soapbox**

 

On a Sketchup-related note - I haven't mentioned this on [bldg-sim] yet, but
Sketchup-savvy users using a version with .dwg export support can actually
export their models into AGI32 for photometric and rendering
lighting/daylight studies after a little work in CAD to ensure a clean
import.  I might write up an illustrated guide or post the full scoop here
at some point in the future, but for those interested in learning
immediately I'll just say to head over to the AGI32 forums to find a lengthy
post (intended to troubleshoot other AGI32-specific issues) where I composed
a pretty decent outline of the process to start.

 

~Nick

 

cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB

 

NICK CATON, E.I.T.

PROJECT ENGINEER

25501 west valley parkway

olathe ks 66061

direct 913 344.0036

fax 913 345.0617

Check out our new web-site @ www.smithboucher.com 

 

From: bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org
[mailto:bldg-sim-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Kyte
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 2:43 PM
To: Jackson, Alan; EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Cc: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a
GUI

 

Free sketchup is not going to support dwg importing for much longer.

 

  _____  

From: Jackson, Alan [mailto:ajackson at klingstubbins.com] 
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 1:09 PM
To: EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Cc: bldg-sim at lists.onebuilding.org
Subject: Re: [Bldg-sim] [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a
GUI

 

In what sense?

 

If you mean it doesn't have every single capability of modeling like the IDF
or Text editor would, yes. But nothing does. It's hard to keep up with the
E+ developer cycle ;-)

 

If you mean it doesn't run off Energyplus 3.0. It does.

 

I don't use it because it's too expensive. I prefer OpenStudio and the IDF
Editor/Textpad because you have access to all the capabilities that E+ has
to offer, but it took me years to become even semi comfortable (read:
confident) with modeling through a txt file. 

 

Either way maybe this should be moved over to BLDG-SIM. 

 

Alan Jackson, LEED AP
KlingStubbins

 

From: EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
[mailto:EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Emanuele Naboni
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 1:03 PM
To: EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a GUI

 

  

Yes, but Hevacomp does not have the capabilities of EnergyPlus.

 

-- 
Emanuele Naboni

per l'Italia: 346.4133337
from US: +39.346.4133337
skype: emanuelenaboni
MArch, PhD Building Science, LEED AP, EU licensed architect

Please consider the environment before printing this email.

2009/10/29 Jackson, Alan <ajackson at klingstubbins.com>

  

You should look into Hevacomp which is being revamped for the US. 

 

Alan Jackson, LEED AP
KlingStubbins

 

From: EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
[mailto:EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Josh K
Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 12:00 PM
To: EnergyPlus_Support at yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] I need advices for choosing a GUI

 

  

Hello;

My feeling is that their currently is not a *perfect* GUI for EnergyPlus,
especially if you're interested in interoperability (ie IFC, gbXML, etc).
Designbuilder seems to be getting closest in this regard, but when I tested
it a while ago I found the modelling interface to be a bit clumsy and
restrictive. OpenStudio is not bad, but still needs a little work to be
practical for every day use (for instance, to my knowledge there is
currently no good way to specify a heat transfer surface's adjacency
conditions). I currently use ECOTECT, which had a lot of promise when I
started using it three years ago but has progressed exactly zero since then.
I don't know much about the other system you mention.

To summarize: the three you mention will all probably work for you, and each
have their own advantages and disadvantages. If you're specifically
interested in IFC compatibility, I'm not sure about the status of
DesignBuilder in this respect, but neither OpenStudio nor ECOTECT currently
have this capability. 

Josh

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 7:14 AM, bcavallier <bruno.cavallier at femto-st.fr>
wrote:

  


Hello,

I want to learn EnergyPlus but I need a GUI. As it is a new activity for me,
I would like to find the better couple [E+/GUI] regarding my needs. I am
mainly interested in building energy simulation, particularly on the topics
of energy efficiency and the smart use of solar energy for solar passive
designing. I saw a lot of software on the web : Google Sketch Up with
Openstudio, Designbuilder (well described at Harvard), Ecotect...

How can I make the best choice? My choice will use the IFC standard. I saw
another software : Digital Project of Gehry Technologies which is based on
Catia (Dassault Systemes) that works with IFC standards, but has anyone made
simulation with [E+/this soft]?

Could you give me advices, please...

Best regards

B.Cavallier




-- 
Josh Kjenner, P.Eng., LEED AP
Manasc Isaac Architects Ltd.
10225 100 Avenue :: Edmonton, AB T5J 0A1
780.429.3977




-- 
Emanuele Naboni

per l'Italia: 346.4133337
from US: +39.346.4133337
skype: emanuelenaboni
www.emanuele-naboni.com 
sustainable design consultant - consulente per la sostenibilita' di
tecnologie, edifici e citta'
MArch, PhD Building Science, LEED AP, EU licensed architect

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