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Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: unit ventilator woes
I found my error with regard to my second problem: the problem was that
although there wasn't a heating load, because I was using a SINGLE HEATING
SETPOINT, there wasn't a *cooling *load, which is what is required for the
UNIT VENTILATOR fan to run when there is no cooling coil. Switching the zone
control to SINGLE HEATING/COOLING SETPOINT solved my problem.
I'll note, though, that the first problem persisted; again on the summer
design day, when the UNIT VENTILATOR was running and drawing 100% outside
air, I was seeing equal flowrates from its OA node, the zone exhaust node to
which it was connected, and the zone inlet node to which it was connected.
Checking the UNIT VENTILATOR fan inlet node temperature verified that the
air was indeed coming from outside, so, again, it seems that the flow
through the zone exhaust node connected to the unit ventilator should be
zero.
Anyway -- thanks for the responses and assistance.
Josh
On Jan 25, 2008 1:24 PM, Josh K <jeemang@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Hi Richard;
>
> Thanks for the reply. It's good to know that I can ignore the error, but
> it seems like this could possibly be a bug in the software. When a UNIT
> VENTILATOR is drawing 100% outside air, it doesn't seem like the zone
> exhaust node that it is connected to should be showing any flow...
>
> Also, I had a second issue that remains a problem: that of the UNIT
> VENTILATOR not running in a COOLING/NO COIL/FIXED AMOUNT scenario.
> Specifically: my UNIT VENTILATOR uses an outside air control type of FIXED
> AMOUNT, and has only a heating coil and no cooling coil. On the summer
> design day, when there is no heating load, the UNIT VENTILATOR in my model
> isn't turning on when its component availability schedule is > 0 as the
> documentation suggests that it should be. Can you think of a reason why this
> is happening?
>
> Thanks a lot for your help,
>
> Josh
>
>
>
> On Jan 25, 2008 11:33 AM, Richard Raustad <RRaustad@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > If the exhaust fan and the unit ventilator always operate together and
> >
> > at the same flow rate, you can disregard the warning.
> >
> >
> > Josh K wrote:
> > >
> > > Thanks for your reply.
> > >
> > > The thing is, is I want the exhaust fan to be in there. The purpose of
> > the
> > > UNIT VENTILATOR object is to simulate the real-life makeup air unit
> > that
> > > supplies the zone with air when the exhaust fan is running. So,
> > although
> > > removing the exhaust fan would fix the air imbalance problem within
> > > EnergyPlus, it would also result in the physical situation I'm trying
> > to
> > > model not being represented accurately.
> > >
> > > Josh
> > >
> > > On Jan 25, 2008 11:16 AM, tjutw <tjutw@xxxxxxxxx <tjutw%40yahoo.com>
> > > <mailto:tjutw%40yahoo.com>> wrote:
> > >
> > > > From EnergyPlus InputOutput reference, I think exhaust fan is not
> > > > necessary in your input file.
> > > >
> > > > Field: outside air relief node
> > > > This field is a node name (character string) used to identify the
> > node
> > > > associated with air exhausted out of the unit ventilator to the
> > > > outdoor environment.
> > > >
> > > > After removing the exhaust fan, there is no warning about "air
> > > imbalance".
> > > >
> > > > Hope it helps,
> > > >
> > > > Tj Ywh
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com
> > ><EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>,
> >
> > > > "Josh K" <jeemang@...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I've uploaded the simulation file in case anyone wants to take a
> > > > look at it.
> > > > >
> > > > > Many thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Josh
> > > > >
> > > > > On Jan 18, 2008 4:47 PM, josh_miarch <jeemang@...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > I've created a simple one-zone model, in which the single zone
> > is
> > > > > > conditioned in the following manner:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -a constant volume of ventilation air is supplied during
> > occupied
> > > > > > hours from the central AHU (via a DIRECT AIR object)
> > > > > > -there is a unit heater to heat the space during unoccupied
> > > hours, and
> > > > > > make up any additional heating load not covered by the central
> > AHU
> > > > > > during occupied hours
> > > > > > -there is an exhaust fan that runs in the middle of occupied
> > days,
> > > > > > removing a volume of air from the room in excess of the air
> > supplied
> > > > > > from the central AHU
> > > > > > -there is a makeup air unit to supply a volume of air to the
> > zone
> > > > > > equal to that removed from the zone by the exhaust fan when the
> > > > > > exhaust fan is running. I've attempted to simulate this with a
> > UNIT
> > > > > > VENTILATOR object, where I've set the maximum air flow rate, the
> > > > > > maximum OA air flow rate, and the minimum OA air flow rate to a
> > > volume
> > > > > > equal to that specified in the ZONE EXHAUST FAN, chosen the
> > FIXED
> > > > > > AMOUNT outside air control type, and assigned the object the
> > same
> > > > > > component availability schedule as the exhaust fan it is meant
> > to be
> > > > > > compensating for.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm having a couple of problems with this system.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. I'm getting an air imbalance when the exhaust fan/MUA combo
> > is
> > > > > > running. As I understand it, EnergyPlus calculates a zone air
> > > balance
> > > > > > strictly by subtracting the sum of the flow through the zone
> > exhaust
> > > > > > nodes from the sum of the flow through the zone inlet nodes and
> > > > > > assigning the difference, if any, to flow through the zone
> > return
> > > > > > node. However, I'm running into a problem where the sum of the
> > flow
> > > > > > through the exhaust nodes exceeds the sum of the flow through
> > the
> > > > > > inlet nodes.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Looking into this further, I saw that the problem seems to lie
> > with
> > > > > > the UNIT VENTILATOR. I've set the unit's fan volume flow rate to
> > an
> > > > > > amount equal to the minimum OA flowrate specified in the UNIT
> > > > > > VENTILATOR description, so presumably when the unit runs, it
> > > should be
> > > > > > drawing air entirely from its OA node. However, what actually
> > > happens
> > > > > > is that it draws an amount equal to it's fan volume flow rate
> > from
> > > > > > both the OA node AND the zone exhaust node to which it is
> > connected.
> > > > > > As well, it outputs air into its zone inlet node at this same
> > > rate --
> > > > > > meaning that a volume of air equal to the unit fan's volume flow
> >
> > > rate
> > > > > > is basically disappearing.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I guess I'm wondering if I've specified a part of the file
> > wrong, or
> > > > > > if my understanding of how these components work together is
> > somehow
> > > > > > flawed.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 2. The UNIT VENTILATOR I've specified has no cooling coil, but
> > in
> > > > > > situations where there is a cooling load, I'd like it add to the
> >
> > > zone
> > > > > > a volume of outside air at the outside ambient temperature to
> > > make up
> > > > > > for the air leaving the zone via the zone's exhaust fan.
> > > According to
> > > > > > the Input/Output manual, when a UNIT VENTILATOR is in a
> > COOLING/NO
> > > > > > COIL/FIXED AMOUNT scenario (which I've presumably described),
> > "The
> > > > > > unit ventilator fixes the outside air flow rate as defined by
> > > the user
> > > > > > and sets the maximum and minimum outside air flow rate to be
> > > equal in
> > > > > > order to avoid the variation of outside air flow rate between
> > the
> > > > > > maximum and minimum values. Since a coil is not present to
> > further
> > > > > > condition the supply air, the zone simply receives whatever
> > > > > > temperature air results from the outside air controls."
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That is pretty much what I want to happen, assuming that the
> > maximum
> > > > > > and minimum outside air flowrates, when made equal, are set to
> > the
> > > > > > amounts that I've entered in the UNIT VENTILATOR description
> > (which
> > > > > > are equal). Unfortunately, this is not happening; when there
> > isn't a
> > > > > > heating load, the UNIT VENTILATOR doesn't run. Again, I'm
> > > wondering if
> > > > > > anyone knows what I might be doing wrong.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sorry for the amazingly long post, and thanks for any help I may
> > > > receive.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Josh
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Josh Kjenner, EIT, LEED AP
> > > > > Manasc Isaac Architects Ltd.
> > > > > 10225 100 Avenue :: Edmonton, AB T5J 0A1
> > > > > 780.429.3977
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Josh Kjenner, EIT, LEED AP
> > > Manasc Isaac Architects Ltd.
> > > 10225 100 Avenue :: Edmonton, AB T5J 0A1
> > > 780.429.3977
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Richard A. Raustad
> > Senior Research Engineer
> > Florida Solar Energy Center
> > University of Central Florida
> > 1679 Clearlake Road
> > Cocoa, FL 32922-5703
> > Phone: (321) 638-1454
> > Fax: (321) 638-1439 or 1010
> > Visit our web site at: http://www.fsec.ucf.edu
> >
> > UCF - From Promise to Prominence: Celebrating 40 Years
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> Josh Kjenner, EIT, LEED AP
> Manasc Isaac Architects Ltd.
> 10225 100 Avenue :: Edmonton, AB T5J 0A1
> 780.429.3977
>
--
Josh Kjenner, EIT, LEED AP
Manasc Isaac Architects Ltd.
10225 100 Avenue :: Edmonton, AB T5J 0A1
780.429.3977
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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