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RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Double wheel energy Recovery





Thanks for the feedback!

 

John,  I have some contacts at SEMCO and already have placed a call; we’ll see what results that might produce.  It’s helpful to know, though, that it’s a work in progress.

 

Chris,  Part of the reason for asking whether anyone has  “attempted to precisely simulate the controls” is that I thought I might model the passive dehumidification wheel by using a “HeatExchanger:AirToAir:SensibleandLatent” object and just zero the sensible effectiveness.  This is very simplistic, but I thought it would get me most of the way toward the actual performance.

 

I should qualify by saying that, while I have essentially duplicated the SEMCO “total enthalpy” wheel’s performance and energy use in a spreadsheet (because I like to that sort of thing and a client wanted more info than SEMCO’s own spreadsheets would provide), I haven’t got the same level of knowledge about their Pinnacle wheel.  It seems, though, that its principal purpose is to just remove moisture�..

 

The Building Performance Team
James V. Dirkes II, P.E., LEED AP
1631 Acacia Drive NW
Grand Rapids, MI 49504
616 450 8653

 

From: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John
Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2010 8:29 PM
To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Double wheel energy Recovery

 

 

To cjm23113 and Jim,
If you contact your local rep.  Send the input criteria required to them and the equation requirements, they would probably help you.  Several senior people at Semco are working with the different energy modeling software developers, (Trane, HAP, eQuest, Eplus is on the list) to develop algorithyms  so the Pinnacle and EP units can be modeled.  The one with HAP is complete.  They recognize this is a problem.  I don't know if they can accomplish this in the time you need, but provided them all the input info required and engineering references might help speed the response up, so they are not looking at the info "blind".

John

 


From: cjm23113 <cjm23113@xxxxxxxxx>
To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thu, June 10, 2010 6:25:54 PM
Subject: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Double wheel energy Recovery

 



Jim,

I have actually encountered these same questions trying to model the Semco Pinnacle myself. I have modeled the system and managed to get it to run using Dehumidifier:Desiccant:System and HeatExchanger:Desiccant:BalancedFlow. The problem with this solution is that HeatExchanger:Desiccant:BalancedFlow requires a HeatExchanger:Desiccant:BalancedFlow:PerformanceDataType1. This performance curve has 51 fields (16 of which are equation coefficients) and only two examples in PerfCurves.idf (neither of which seem remotely close to the Semco Pinnacle - they are for systems with reactivation heaters). I would imagine that it would be nearly impossible to get any manufacturer to give you enough information to create this performance curve yourself. I'd like to talk more about this offline if you are interested.

Does anyone else have any input? I think that passive desiccant wheels will only become more prevalent with time and I would love to see them get accurately modeled sooner rather than later.

Chris

--- In EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "jvd2pe" <jvd2pe@...> wrote:
>
> Dear E+ forum,
>
> I've been asked to model a double wheel energy recovery unit, similar to a Semco Pinnacle. I have two questions for you:
> 1) The general idea seems reasonably straightforward, but I have only modeled a single wheel style previously, and wonder if there are any surprises or special approaches that must be used for a double wheel.
> 2) The controls for these units are rather sophisticated to minimize energy use and prevent freezing or condensation in the wheel. Has anyone attempted to precisely simulate the controls for something like a Pinnacle? Care to share tips?
>
> p.s., If, after feedback and further study, I am not confident that I can properly create the model, I will tell my client that they should look for another modeler who is more talented than I in this particular area. Would any of you like a call? If so, please let me know via private communication. (jim@...)
>

 



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