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Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] report

To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] report
From: "Michael J. Witte" <mjwitte@xxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2004 15:15:15 -0500
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Reply-to: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

The surface inside face heat balance consists of conduction, radiation, and 
convection, and these must sum to zero.  Your original question tried to relate 
surface inside face conduction to zone load.  In a forced air HVAC system, the 
load is entirely based on the convective gains to the zone air, the thermostat 
senses zone air temperature and the system acts upon the zone air.  So load, 
Zone/Sys Sensible Cooling or Heating, is calculated by adding the convective 
gains from the surfaces plus convective gains from lights, people, and 
equipment.  I see now that you were also trying to compare to "Zone/Sys 
Sensible Load Predicted".  That is an approximate load, you should use Zone/Sys 
Sensible Cooling Energy (or Heating).

Mike


On 8 Apr 2004, at 11:36, Ian Doebber wrote:

> Shouldn't the "Opaque Surface Inside Face Conduction" be equal to the amount of
> heat flux entering a zone combining the convection and radiation.  I thought
> that using "SurfaceInsideTemperature - ZoneAir Temperature) * SurfaceArea *
> SurfaceInsideConvectionCoefficient" just accounted for the convective effect on
> the zone.  I thought the heat flux infinitesimally inside the wall surface
> should be equal to the heat flux to or from the zone.  Am I wrong in this
> assumption.  Does the SurfaceInsideConvectionCoefficient incorporate the
> radiation and convective heat transfer.
> 
> Thanks
> Ian
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Michael J. Witte 
>   To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
>   Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 3:34 PM
>   Subject: Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] report
> 
> 
>   Opaque Surface Inside Face Conduction is intended for detailed examination of
>   the heat balance on a particular inside surface, primarly to support
>   comparisons with measured data.  It is not meaningful as a component of the
>   current heating or cooling load.  Surfaces interact with the zone air heat
>   balance by convection.  So, the value of most interest is
>   (SurfaceInsideTemperature - ZoneAir Temperature) * SurfaceArea *
>   SurfaceInsideConvectionCoefficient to calculate the current load due to the
>   surfaces.  This will include the current load due to solar gains, because
>   solar becomes a load by warming a surface.
> 
>   For an example of comparing the load with a hand calculation, see files 
>   UAdeltaT,zip and UAdeltaT2.zip in
> 
>   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/files/Examples/
> 
>   Mike
> 
> 
>   On 5 Apr 2004, at 20:16, David Cormier wrote:
> 
>   > Hello,
>   > 
>   > I do a simple test with EnergyPlus.  It's about a simple room with no 
>   > internal load.  I look at the result
>   > 
>   > If I add : ZONE1:Zone Window Heat Gain[W](Hourly) + MUR1:Opaque Surface >
>   Inside Face Conduction Loss[W](Hourly) or gain for my wall + TOIT:Opaque >
>   Surface Inside Face Conduction Loss[W](Hourly) or gain > > I think that I
>   suppose to have the same result as ZONE1:Zone/Sys Sensible > Load
>   Predicted[W](Hourly).  In heating, its ok, but in cooling, I have a > mistake
>   because the result of the add is always higher than the result of >
>   ZONE1:Zone/Sys Sensible Load Predicted[W] > > I suppose that I forget a term
>   in the add ... Do you have an idea? > > David Cormier > >
>   _________________________________________________________________ > MSN
>   Messenger : discutez en direct avec vos amis !  > http://messenger.fr.msn.ca/
>   > > > > The primary EnergyPlus web site is found at: >
>   http://www.energyplus.gov > > The group web site is: >
>   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/ > > Attachments are not
>   allowed -- please post any files to the appropriate folder > in the Files are
>   of the Support Web Site. > > > > >  -- please post any files to the
>   appropriate folder in the Files are of the >  Support Web Site. > > > > > >
>   Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > 
> 
> 
> 
>   ========================================================
>   Michael J. Witte, GARD Analytics, Inc.
>   EnergyPlus Testing and Support      
>   EnergyPlus-Support@xxxxxxxx
> 
> 
> 
>   The primary EnergyPlus web site is found at:
>   http://www.energyplus.gov
> 
>   The group web site is:
>   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/
> 
>   Attachments are not allowed -- please post any files to the appropriate folder
>   in the Files are of the Support Web Site.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   -- please post any files to the appropriate folder in the Files are of the
>   Support Web Site.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The primary EnergyPlus web site is found at:
> http://www.energyplus.gov
> 
> The group web site is:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EnergyPlus_Support/
> 
> Attachments are not allowed -- please post any files to the appropriate folder
> in the Files are of the Support Web Site.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  -- please post any files to the appropriate folder in the Files are of the
>  Support Web Site.
> 
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> Yahoo! Groups Links
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> 



========================================================
Michael J. Witte, GARD Analytics, Inc.
EnergyPlus Testing and Support      
EnergyPlus-Support@xxxxxxxx



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References:
- Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] report
  - From: Ian Doebber

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