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RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.

To: <EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.
From: "kooi" <kooi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2007 15:21:08 +0800
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Hi everybody, Sorry for inconveniences if you have been reading. I solved
this problem myself and ran into another which I have posted as a new topic.
Cheers, ooi

 

  _____  

From: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of kooi
Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 11:57 AM
To: EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.

 

Hello everyone, I changed the room to 24m square, keeping cooling air at
13°C and from Oct to Mar, the zone temperature dropped from 36 to 31°C. ooi 

_____ 

From: EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
[mailto:EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of kooi
Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 8:47 AM
To: EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.

i ran a 6mx6mx3m building/zone with Purchase Air (NO LIMIT to cooling and
LIMIT the heating with 0 max) in Kuching weather.

The output shows that for 6 months, Oct to Mar, the occupants are not
comfortable and the mean air temperature is above 36 degrees

I changed the purchased cooling air temperature from 13 to 3 degrees C, but
no improvement in the output. Can I upload the file? ooi

_____ 

From: EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
[mailto:EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael J. Witte
Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 6:25 AM
To: EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.

I have never seen an "anomalous" building that did not have a specific
reason 
for not converging. Typical causes are extremely heavy thermal mass (such as

concrete which is 1m thick) or insufficient HVAC or other heat loss modes to

remove heat from the zone. For example, a zone with no exterior surfaces, no

infiltration, and an HVAC system with capacity smaller than the internal
gains 
will simply get hotter and hotter and hotter on each successive warmup day.

Mike

On 23 Feb 2007 at 9:00, Albert Sitorus wrote:

> Dear Linda and Kooi,
> 
> I run 1ZoneEvapCooler.idf with design days and weather file. The zone has 
> been added quite a big load which consists of electric equipment, interior
> lighting and people. For Electric equip., its design is 569W. Interior
lighting
> is 761.5W. The number of max number of people is 2. Kooi, are these items
what
> you added with standard schedules?
> 
> If you run this file using design days without interior lighting, electric
> equipment and people loads, it would run without any convergence problem.
When
> you add the other loads using design days, it will cause the convergence
problem
> even with 1000 warm-up days. On the other hand if you run this file with
> interior lighting, electric equipments and people loads using weather
file, then
> the convergence problem will disappear.
> 
> It seems like increasing warm-up days will not solve the convergence 
> problem. As stated in the input output reference, increasing warm-up days 
> will not necessarily solve a convergence problem. There may be anomalous 
> buildings that will have convergence problem. The additional loads are
quite
> large for a zone that is surrounded by construction materials with high
thermal
> absorptance which almost represent black bodies. This might be one of
those
> anomalous buildings. Even though this is a fictional building. Therefore,
the
> walls absorb heat from all those heat loads, and then release it as a day
wears
> on. The HVAC system can't cool the building enough to get the convergence.
As
> stated in final error summary, point 2. It would be nice to know from
which day
> the convergence problem occurs (summer or winter days).
> 
> My hypothesis is not 100% correct but it makes sense to me. My hypothesis 
> would be a mood point if the schedules for these loads were extreme. In my
file,
> the schedules are standard. Please let me know if my hypothesis was in
correct
> or not making sense. I am very curious what you guys think. My original
problems
> were Eplus output and air loop total heating and cooling energies that
don't
> make sense. I solved the output problem, thanks to Brent Griffith, but the
air
> loop total heating and cooling energies problem still persist......
> 
> Thank you for your time and help, I appreciate them greatly.
> 
> Albert Sitorus.
> 
> 
> 
> >From: "kooi" <kooi@swinburne. <mailto:kooi%40swinburne.edu.my> edu.my>
> >Reply-To: EnergyPlus_Support@
<mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com> yahoogroups.com
> >To: <EnergyPlus_Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus_Support%40yahoogroups.com>
yahoogroups.com>
> >Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.
> >Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 12:54:04 +0800
> >
> >My apologies, if my earlier message was not specific enough. Part of the
> >error message I got from the err file, using Denver weather file was
> >
> >
> >
> >Loads Initialization did not Converge
> >
> > ************* ..1) very high thermal mass such as very thick concrete
> >(solution: increase max number of warmup
> >
> > ************* .. days in the BUILDING object);
> >
> >
> >
> >I changed the warm up days in the BUILDING object to 1000 but the above
> >persisted.
> >
> >
> >
> >Kind regards
> >
> >ooi
> >
> 
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> 
> 
> The primary EnergyPlus web site is found at:
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> 
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> 

========================================================
Michael J. Witte, GARD Analytics, Inc.
EnergyPlus Testing and Support 
EnergyPlus-Support@ <mailto:EnergyPlus-Support%40gard.com> gard.com

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References:
- RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Confusion about Eplus output.
  - From: kooi

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