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Re: [EnergyPlus_Support] Re: Simulating an ice hockey rink





FYI, back in 2010, we provided this answer on the helpdesk for modeling ice rinks:

Question: How do you model an ice rink in EnergyPlus?

Answer: There is no ice rink model presently in EnergyPlus (v6.0, October 2010).

Two possible approaches would be:

1) Use Refrigeration:Case and try to adjust it's inputs to be more like a rink (zero out the internal gains, defrost, etc.) and connect it to a refrigeration compressor system. My concern with this is that I don't think this model interacts radiantly with the zone surfaces which is large component of an ice rink's impact on the zone.

2) Use ZoneHVAC:LowTemperatureRadiant:* to model the rink surface, but then you would have to use a chiller modified to operate at low temperatures to provide the refrigeration (and at present, as of v6.0, use water as the plant loop fluid, it will keep flowing at freezing temperatures).

At 06:06 AM 3/6/2013, rokkas80 wrote:
Thank you Javed, I had a quick look on that example rink of yours and really looks interesting. I suppose I've to learn eQuest (not very fond of those imperial metrics though).

For others interested in modeling of ice rinks, I noticed that IDA ICE 4.5 has an "Ice rink pools"-extension in beta release. 

Regards,
Lukas Lundström
 

--- In EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Javed Iqbal <eee.javed@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Lukas,
>
>
> I know some of the senior analyst they used eQuest for Ice rink modeling
> and there results were well validated with the design numbers though i
>  haven't explored it personally:) Also find an example equest file for
> Icerink.
>
> Hope this helps!
>
> On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 2:21 PM, Karen Walkerman <kwalkerman@...>wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > Hi Lukas,
> >
> > I modeled an existing ice rink facility with eQuest and had excellent
> > results.  It's been a number of years so I don't remember all of the
> > details, but I was able to model all the basics, air stratification,
> > Zamboni load, airspeed, subfloor heaters.  I wasn't able to model desicant
> > dehumidification, which was the only major downfall.
> >
> > --
> > Karen
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 2:00 PM, rokkas80 <lukas.rokka@...> wrote:
> >
> >> **
> >>
> >>
> >> Thank you Jeff, I'll check those papers.
> >>
> >> James, you right it's quite a challenge. But there are so many factors to
> >> consider with a hockey arena that whole building simulations seems the
> >> right way to go in the long term.
> >>
> >> Karen, thank you for the hint. I'm not familiar with eQuest but I'll look
> >> into that. Did you find the simulations useful and reliable?
> >>
> >> I'm not going to start modeling today, just looking into the
> >> possibilities and benefits of an whole building simulation and trying to
> >> estimate how much work and money it requires.
> >>
> >> The sport center I'm working with has 3 hockey rinks and 2 "bandy rinks"
> >> (don't know the English name, I think just we Scandinavians and Russians
> >> play this game but the ice sheet is about 4 times larger that of an ice
> >> hockey rink), 1 outdoor all-year around football arena and lots of other
> >> less energy consuming facilities. There exist quite good hourly energy
> >> consumption data on most facilities, refrigerators and heat pumps.
> >>
> >> Especially the bandy arena would be hard to model with it's volume of
> >> about 150 000 m3, having almost natural conditions at some parts with a
> >> strong temperature stratification of the air.
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >> Lukas Lundström
> >>
> >>
> >> --- In EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Karen Walkerman wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Hi Lukas,
> >> >
> >> > I have modeled a few ice rinks, although in eQuest (which has the
> >> ability
> >> > to model ice rinks). Although I prefer EnergyPlus for most projects,
> >> > eQuest may be the better tool for this project.
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Karen
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 10:33 AM, Jim Dirkes
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > **
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Lukas,****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > I have not modeled an ice rink, but it would be a big challenge! I
> >> > > commissioned one about 20 years ago, however, and still have some
> >> reference
> >> > > material, so I attached it here. Jeff's comments echo completely true,
> >> > > considering that a Zamboni resurfacer melts the entire surface each
> >> time it
> >> > > is used.****
> >> > >
> >> > > ** **
> >> > >
> >> > > ** **
> >> > >
> >> > > *James V Dirkes II, PE, BEMP, LEED AP**
> >> > > ** www.buildingperformanceteam.com*
> >> http://www.buildingperformanceteam.com/>
> >> > > *
> >> > > **Energy Analysis, Commissioning & Training Services**
> >> > > *1631 Acacia Drive, Grand Rapids, MI 49504 USA
> >> > > 616 450 8653****
> >> > >
> >> > > ** **
> >> > >
> >> > > *From:* EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
> >> > > EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Jeff Haberl
> >> > > *Sent:* Monday, March 04, 2013 10:05 AM
> >> > > *To:* EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> > > *Subject:* RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Simulating an ice hockey rink****
> >> > >
> >> > > ** **
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >> > >
> >> > > Hello,****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > FYI, a paper on this was written in 1985 that used DOE-2 simulations
> >> that
> >> > > estimated the rink by adjusting the UA(deltaT) to match energy use
> >> data of
> >> > > the compresors collected on site. Problem with the building was that
> >> the
> >> > > ice rink was right above the women's locker room, which placed the
> >> cold
> >> > > radiative surface in a bad place. One of the largest "loads" was the
> >> > > Zamboni machine, which resurfaced the rink, and thereby had to be
> >> scheduled.
> >> > > ****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > Haberl, J., Claridge, D. 1985. "Retrofit Energy Studies of a
> >> Recreation
> >> > > Center," *ASHRAE Transactions-Research,* Vol. 91, Pt. 2, pp. 1421 -
> >> 1433
> >> > > (June). ****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > Additional material can be found another paper, that discusses how an
> >> > > empirical model and an expert system was used to predict on-going
> >> problems.
> >> > > ****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > Haberl, J., Claridge, D. 1987. "An Expert System for Building Energy
> >> > > Consumption Analysis: Prototype Results,"* ASHRAE
> >> Transactions-Research, *Vol.
> >> > > 93, Pt. 1, pp. 979 - 998 (January). ****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >> > >
> >> > > Jeff****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > 8=! 8=) :=) 8=) ;=) 8=) 8=( 8=) 8=() 8=) 8=| 8=) :=') 8=)8=?
> >> > > Jeff S. Haberl, Ph.D.,P.E.,FASHRAE,FIBPSA,........jhaberl@
> >> ...<........jhaberl@>
> >>
> >> > >
> >> Professor............................................................Office
> >> > > Ph: 979-845-6507
> >> > > Department of Architecture.............................Lab Ph:
> >> 979-845-6065
> >> > > Energy Systems Laboratory.............................FAX:
> >> 979-862-2457
> >> > > Texas A&M University.....................................77843-3581
> >> > > College Station, Texas, USA, 77843..................URL:
> >> www.esl.tamu.edu
> >> > > 8=/ 8=) :=) 8=) ;=) 8=) 8=() 8=) :=) 8=) 8=! 8=) 8=? 8=)8=0***
> >> > > *
> >> > > ------------------------------
> >> > >
> >> > > *From:* EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [
> >>
> >> > > EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] on behalf of rokkas80 [
> >> > > lukas.rokka@]
> >> > > *Sent:* Monday, March 04, 2013 8:51 AM
> >> > > *To:* EnergyPlus_Support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> > > *Subject:* [EnergyPlus_Support] Simulating an ice hockey rink****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >>
> >> > >
> >> > > Hi,
> >> > >
> >> > > Does anyone here have experience from modeling an indoor ice hockey
> >> rink?
> >> > > I'm wondering how to model the Ice sheet in EnergyPlus?
> >> > >
> >> > > Lukas Lundström
> >> > > https://sites.google.com/site/weatherconverter/****
> >> > >
> >> > > ****
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> > 
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> Javed Iqbal, LEED AP, CEA
> Energy Analyst
>




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