# [Equest-users] Defining Building and Fixed Shades using Coordinates Alone

Arpan Bakshi arpanbakshi at gmail.com
Tue Apr 17 14:06:22 PDT 2012

```Nick, these examples are quite impressive and DO look like a lot of work! A
question about the dummy zone approach--my understanding is that any
geometry which is a subset of a zone or window only shades the parent
object, whereas a building & fixed shade element shades all geometry in the
model. How did you bypass this issue? Thank you!

Arpan Bakshi, LEED AP BD+C

On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Nick Caton <ncaton at smithboucher.com> wrote:

>  Hi Arpan,****
>
> ** **
>
> I’d hate to lead you into an unnecessarily time-consuming path, but I have
> on rare occasion found it helpful to approach defining complex building
> shades as exterior wall sections under a dummy space, which themselves can
> be defined referencing a polygon, which in turn can be defined in
> (relative) XYZ point coordinates…  What you functionally lose along the way
> is the ability to assign a shading schedule or otherwise alter the opacity
> of the resulting “shade.”****
>
> ** **
>
> Disclaimer:  Defining shades with exterior wall sections is likely going
> to be time consuming, however you slice it.  Like anything worth doing,
> right =)?****
>
> ** **
>
> If you’re interested in pursuing this, you should first consider whether
> the shade you’re emulating  can be represented/approximated in 2D.  I did a
> writeup once (full discussion attached) showing how one can apply the
> concept above to represent a complex, repeating shape to pick up the
> shading of a superstructure.  Here’s an illustration showing the end-result:
> ****
>
> ** **
>
> [image: cid:image005.png at 01CB5978.13595400]****
>
> ** **
>
> To up the ante, with another tier of effort you can approach approximating
> 3D shapes with polygonal exterior wall sections… but I would sooner advise
> strongly considering whether a 2D equivalent can be defined, or if you
> might better invest your time learning a more complex-geometry-compliant
> energy modeling software (I keep meaning to do this!).  Following is a
> visual of using polygonal exterior wall sections as shades to achieve a 3D
> shape – this was not a small amount of work:****
>
> ** **
>
> ****
>
> ** **
>
> A couple folks have, in years past, developed impressive looking export
> tools (from the likes of sketchup, revit and so forth) that at least appear
> to automate production of polygons for complex geometries in eQuest… I’ve
> never seen any of these freely distributed nor test-driven any such
> tool/process myself, so I can’t endorse further other than to note they’re
> out there and might be available, for a cost.****
>
> ** **
>
> Best of luck!****
>
> ** **
>
> ~Nick****
>
> ** **
>
> [image: cid:489575314 at 22072009-0ABB]**
>
> * *
>
> *NICK CATON, P.E.***
>
> SENIOR ENGINEER****
>
> ** **
>
> Smith & Boucher Engineers****
>
> 25501 west valley parkway, suite 200****
>
> olathe, ks 66061****
>
> direct 913.344.0036****
>
> fax 913.345.0617****
>
> www.smithboucher.com* *****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org [mailto:
> equest-users-bounces at lists.onebuilding.org] *On Behalf Of *Arpan Bakshi
> *Sent:* Monday, April 16, 2012 8:07 PM
> *To:* equest-users
> *Subject:* [Equest-users] Defining Building and Fixed Shades using
> Coordinates Alone****
>
> ** **
>
> Fixed and Building Shades are presently defined in DOE2/eQUEST using:****
>
>  ****
>
> X-REF     ****
>
> Y-REF     ****
>
> Z-REF     ****
>
> HEIGHT  ****
>
> WIDTH    ****
>
> AZIMUTH****
>
>  ****
>
> Has anyone come across an alternate specification method using coordinates
> only? ****
>
> For example:****
>
>  ****
>
> Point 1 (x,y,z)****
>
> Point 2 (x,y,z)****
>
> Point 3 (x,y,z)****
>
> Point 4 (x,y,z)****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
>  ****
>
> Arpan Bakshi, LEED AP BD+C****
>
>  ****
>
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