Eplus document is correct. It is the usage of these field that may not be approproate for the situation. All I am pointing out to the reader is that if you want the OA input to be same as the Fan flow rate, setting the schedule multiplier value to one will not given you what you intended to have.
"This statement is not correct, because by setting the multiplier to 1 does not define the quantity of flow. 1 of zero is still zero."
If you disagree, it is yours to do so. I was just clearifying my thought on this matter.
If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air, (maximum OA flow rate, which may be smaller than the fan flow rate. Return air is still mixed at the mixed node.)
so in a system if 100% outdoor air is required regardless of any other condition, these fields are helpful."
so in a system if 100% outdoor air is required regardless of any other condition, these fields are helpful."
Yes the multipliers are useful to reduce the OA flow rate.
My original e-mail defined what I assume is the 100% fresh OA intake. It is not the full or maximum OA intake by itself.
In face 'autosizing' is also helping to increase the confusion.
Dr. Li
To: energyplus_support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: pedro_peixeiro@xxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 22:22:15 +0000
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Air Exhaust from zones problem
If its not correct, than its a discussion that someone with your experience should have with someone from the E+ team, so people like me that are on a learning stage dont get wrong information. Input/output reference pdf, page 1566, or searching by the pdf page, 1605:
"Field: Minimum Fraction of Outdoor Air Schedule Name
This is an optional field with the schedule values in decimal fractions (0.0-1.0). This field
enables the user to limit the minimum amount of outdoor air permissible and thus also helps
in getting at least the minimum amount of air in.
Field: Maximum Fraction of Outdoor Air Schedule Name
This is an optional field with the schedule values in decimal fractions (0.0-1.0). This field
enables the user to limit the maximum of amount of outdoor air permissible and thus also
limits the permissible maximum outdoor air into the system.
If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air,
so in a system if 100% outdoor air is required regardless of any other condition, these fields
are helpful."
This is directly taken form the pdf. I'm not making things up, i'm just reading the manuals. Clearing out this matter would be usefull, so i can know what to count on. thank you.
To: energyplus_support@yahoogroups.com
From: yli006@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 10:28:15 -0400
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Air Exhaust from zones problem
"If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air"
This statement is not correct, because by setting the multiplier to 1 does not define the quantity of flow. 1 of zero is still zero.
My argument was that the intake air must all flow through the fan and the zone and then exhaust to satisfy the 100% fresh air condition.
Therefore, you make the OA intake rate,(volume) the same as the fan rate. If the fan is not supplied with the air quantity you want, then what is the 100% you are referring to.
Any volume of air that is not supplied by the OA inlet is made up by return air or other means, so that the OA mixer node will satisfy the fan flow requirement, and the 100% fresh air condition is not met.
This argument is not system dependent, excep the Fan. If there is no fan, no wind there is no fresh air..
To: energyplus_support@yahoogroups.com
From: pedro_peixeiro@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 07:41:17 +0000
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Air Exhaust from zones problem
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"Field: Minimum Fraction of Outdoor Air Schedule Name
This is an optional field with the schedule values in decimal fractions (0.0-1.0). This field
enables the user to limit the minimum amount of outdoor air permissible and thus also helps
in getting at least the minimum amount of air in.
Field: Maximum Fraction of Outdoor Air Schedule Name
This is an optional field with the schedule values in decimal fractions (0.0-1.0). This field
enables the user to limit the maximum of amount of outdoor air permissible and thus also
limits the permissible maximum outdoor air into the system.
If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air,
so in a system if 100% outdoor air is required regardless of any other condition, these fields
are helpful."
This is directly taken form the pdf. I'm not making things up, i'm just reading the manuals. Clearing out this matter would be usefull, so i can know what to count on. thank you.
To: energyplus_support@
From: yli006@hotmail.
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 10:28:15 -0400
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_
"If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air"
This statement is not correct, because by setting the multiplier to 1 does not define the quantity of flow. 1 of zero is still zero.
My argument was that the intake air must all flow through the fan and the zone and then exhaust to satisfy the 100% fresh air condition.
Therefore, you make the OA intake rate,(volume) the same as the fan rate. If the fan is not supplied with the air quantity you want, then what is the 100% you are referring to.
Any volume of air that is not supplied by the OA inlet is made up by return air or other means, so that the OA mixer node will satisfy the fan flow requirement, and the 100% fresh air condition is not met.
This argument is not system dependent, excep the Fan. If there is no fan, no wind there is no fresh air..
Dr. Li
To: energyplus_support@
From: pedro_peixeiro@
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 07:41:17 +0000
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_
It makes sense what you say. But there is a way to make sure you have 100% fresh air, like Mario said. I checked the Input/output reference, and it does say the following (relative to Controller:OutdoorAir, Field: Maximum/Minimum Fraction of Outdoor Air Schedule):
"If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air"
For now, i'm just trying to make a simple system working by the most standard way possible, so I can get myself a systematic procedure that assures me adaptability to various situations, so I'll try not to forget the previous point.
Anyway, my problem still persists. I added the OutdoorAir:Mixer and the Controller:OutdoorAir but the program still gives me the same error:
Severe ** Demand Side Outlet Node Name (Return Air Path or ZoneHVAC:EquipmentConnections) not valid = ZONE EQ1 OUTLET NODE
~~~ ** Occurs in AirLoopHVAC = UTANN
This node is defined as the outlet node of the AirLoopHVAC:ZoneMixer and the Demand Side Outlet Node in AirLoopHVAC.
Still need some tips-and-tricks to solve this one. thanks!
Pedro P.
To: energyplus_support@yahoogroups.com
From: yli006@hotmail.com
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2010 13:13:37 -0400
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_Support] Air Exhaust from zones problem
The New Busy think 9 to 5 is a cute idea. Combine multiple calendars with Hotmail. Get busy.
"If both the above schedules are given values of 1.0, the system works at 100% outdoor air"
For now, i'm just trying to make a simple system working by the most standard way possible, so I can get myself a systematic procedure that assures me adaptability to various situations, so I'll try not to forget the previous point.
Anyway, my problem still persists. I added the OutdoorAir:Mixer and the Controller:OutdoorA
Severe ** Demand Side Outlet Node Name (Return Air Path or ZoneHVAC:EquipmentC
~~~ ** Occurs in AirLoopHVAC = UTANN
This node is defined as the outlet node of the AirLoopHVAC:
Still need some tips-and-tricks to solve this one. thanks!
Pedro P.
To: energyplus_support@
From: yli006@hotmail.
Date: Wed, 2 Jun 2010 13:13:37 -0400
Subject: RE: [EnergyPlus_
I have seen many people wanted to use 100% outside air and does not know what to do.
If your OA intake volume rate is the same as the fan capacity and the zone air flow rate, the return air is automatically relieved, 100%.
If you do not connect the return air node of the zone to the OA mixer, the zone air is also 100% exhausted to the outside environment.
Am I right?
To: EnergyPlus_Support@yahoogroups.com
From: pedro_peixeiro@hotmail.com
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2010 08:43:12 +0000
Subject: [EnergyPlus_Support] Air Exhaust from zones problem
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If your OA intake volume rate is the same as the fan capacity and the zone air flow rate, the return air is automatically relieved, 100%.
If you do not connect the return air node of the zone to the OA mixer, the zone air is also 100% exhausted to the outside environment.
Am I right?
Dr. Li
To: EnergyPlus_Support@
From: pedro_peixeiro@
Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2010 08:43:12 +0000
Subject: [EnergyPlus_
hello everyone.
i'm doing my first attempts on HVAC simulation, and i've hit my first wall. The system i'm trying to simulate is working with 100% outside air, and thus i need all zone air to be exhausted outside, with no return. My first idea was to use a AirLoopHVAC:ZoneMizer object to bundle all the air from the zones, and use the Outlet Node Name defined here as the Demand Side Outlet Node Name in the AirLoopHVAC object. But it seems E+ doesnt like my ideia, i'm getting a severe error saying the node name in the AirLoopHVAC object is not valid. If someone could point me out a hint or two on how to do this, or at least reference me an example file that uses a similar system, i would be very gratefull. thank you for your time!
Pedro.
i'm doing my first attempts on HVAC simulation, and i've hit my first wall. The system i'm trying to simulate is working with 100% outside air, and thus i need all zone air to be exhausted outside, with no return. My first idea was to use a AirLoopHVAC:
Pedro.
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